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SPLIT UNBREAKABLE GLASS - A Narrative Experiment Commences

I may do an MKV for the standard version, maybe at 10mbps....MP4 seems to introduce pops at many transitions...pops which are NOT in there in the M2TS...There must be a small trigger which the converter to MP4 picks up....really strange.
 
Here is a short clip of the END CREDIT ROLL, with all the text removed from GLASS, in order to permit me adding back in full credits for all 3 movies. Meticulous work to retain all those shards of glass.....2 days!!!!!!!

 
Hmmmm

With the end credit roll from IMDB at just shy of 8000 words (7924 to be precise), my suites ability to cope with that is grinding to a halt at the three-quarters mark. So some creative work around is needed. I'm going to have to render the right hand side of the credit roll separately from the left hand side. I will then chroma key both as overlays on the clean background credit roll plate I previewed above. Attempting to render the whole thing in situ over the plate just crashes the program. Rendering the whole credit roll, on a black background also does not work....it hangs at about 25% rendered and it takes 20 hours to get to that.

So split screen overlay will do. Visually (having tested it on a 30 sec segment), its indistinguishable when viewed on a big TV, just the method to get there.

My back up will be to chroma key in the end roll from the theatrical version of Split and Unbreakable, which are white on black, and create a clean white on black roll for Glass, and then re color after compositing. I don't think it will come to that.
 
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UPDATE:

Left and Right Side end credit rolls rendered on black for chroma keying onto the tortuous background plate (clip above) prepared.

If I told you how many travelling masks were required, you would all think I'm insane !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Although there have been many small renders of sections of the edit, to test view on TV, yesterday was the first FULL render (without the credit roll composited) of the locked edit (pending tweaks from the two tests viewing i need to do). The M2TS file, rendered at 38 mbps ( the passthru sources all being below that, so no quality loss) was 35GB.

Today I viewed the first 40 minutes, and I have just 7 tweaks to make. Stuff like, gap in audio transition, and audio pop, fade was too slow or long, caption to slow or long, extend a small scoring section, small bit of orphan audio I forgot to remove...that kind of stuff.

I did have a near disaster 2 days ago on the last change needed...There was a section that was a smooth transition from one scene to another, spanning two movies, and I was not happy with the scoring transition. I solved it by applying a fade to black then fade back in. M. Night uses that stylistically and I applied it using his rules, which was a nice coincidence BUT, in my haste to polish this off I forgot that RIPPLE EDITING was off!. Result? All audio and elements which followed, were all out of sync for EVRYTHING which followed. Normally I would hit undo, but I had save the file as a new NAME, and astonishingly we then had a power outage!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

I had a choice to load a previous version up, but that was a days work ago OR invert the error by leaving ripple editing OFF and removing a 38 frame segment of the master line of the edit, hoping that then all assets below would return to their position....which they luckily did! PHEW!!!

I mean seriously, you can't make this shit up.

I also started work on the Artwork which I dont start to work on unless I'm close to submission.

NUFF SAID!

"I know how important our work is".

ps
The number alluded to above is >500...honestly.
I need professional clinical help :)

Is anyone else similarly afflicted by this crazy hobby?
Should we start a thread on edit obsession?

Here's one.
Any one watch " OF OZ THE WIZARD"? Oddly compelling (in small chunks).
I want to do the same for A NEW HOPE, but know it will be torture. I know its insane, but it keeps coming back to me.
 
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UPDATE: THE COUNTDOWN BEGINS 5 ...

- Locked 3hr 32mins
- First pass check completed (earphones)
- End credit roll composited and incorporated
- End credit roll music created from all 3 score CDs...all new
- Artwork, completed
- Trailer 2 : Close to completed
- Revise cut/add list - ongoing
- Corrections pending from 1st pass
- 2nd pass review pending
- Submission pending

This baby is coming folks....
Ciao

"whoever these people are, today they lose"
 
My heart stopped for a second as i read that you saved the out-of-sync file. Fortunately you‘ve been blessed :D
38 mbps, wow. Which parameters were crucial to set it at this bitrate as all the scource is beneath that threshold (my curious mind)?

Also massive respect for the work on the credits.You edit seem to come more and more to cinema standard even beyond.

What do you mean by doind the same with A NEW HOPE like Oz? The structure? (don’t want to derail your thread]
 
SIUse said:
My heart stopped for a second as i read that you saved the out-of-sync file. Fortunately you‘ve been blessed :D
38 mbps, wow. Which parameters were crucial to set it at this bitrate as all the scource is beneath that threshold (my curious mind)?

Also massive respect for the work on the credits.You edit seem to come more and more to cinema standard even beyond.

What do you mean by doind the same with A NEW HOPE like Oz? The structure? (don’t want to derail your thread]
Click to expand...
The OZ edit is the whole film recut so EVERY single word spoken and all text, is in alphabetical order. INSANE.
 
I nearly had a heart attack when 3/4s went out of sync....luckily I just replicated the error that caused it IN REVERSE and it worked. AWFUL moment.

as far as the bit rate, as
Long as the rate I render at is greater than the source file, the program will copy all segments over that are lower and only render new sections, so it will effectively clone the source. It also speeds up rendering since only new portions (such as cross fades, zoom, pan and audio changes) are re rendered. On an edits as dense as this the impact on time to render is less, but it does still help. It also means that the image is as good as possible.

Compression introduces artefacts. In fact, each render is unique since the algorithm never render the same way twice . You try. The file size on two renders of the same thing will have different sizes once done. So I rarely pre render any material in an edit. On this one, the two credit rolls needed pre render since they were very very resource heavy and impacted the memory use of the program. The end credit roll has over 500 floating masks and 8000 words. The opening was fully hand animated for certain parts. Having them laid out as part of the edit slowed the program so much, that I would not have been able to complete this. Remember, we are all using domestic level hardware and software. I certainly can’t afford an AVID suite and the kit to run it….shame really. Maybe Patreon or crowdfunding?
Divorce would follow!
 
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COMMENT:

I just re-read my first post on this thread and boy was my mind in a different place than now.

I was actually quite pessimistic that this could be done the way I have visualized it in my mind. The problem boiled down to wanting to create a hybrid "Cloud Atlas"/"Pulp Fiction" like edit for these three movies. That's all well and good IN YOUR OWN HEAD but, when you actually get down to it, a huge number of issues presented themselves.

For instance, there is actually not quite as much material that one would like to play with than you think. M. Night's movies are, for the most part, incredibly tight from a narrative and character perspective. That means there is not a lot of fluff. Fluff serves a faneditor by facilitating the ability to insert gaps and breaks when placing scenes together that ordinarily, would not work. This meant coming up with other ways to pull it all off. You will see what that was and it is fundamental to the structure. The Godfather Part II exploits that VERY effectively. Non-linear allows for gaps, and viewers plug those gaps them in their mind. "ooo look, he got older"

The other issue is scoring. These are generally heavily scored movies and rightly so. The various themes and motifs are very precisely used. This leads to two further issues. Changing a scene requires a lot of scoring work and adding music MUST adhere to the rules established by the director or the audience may become emotional confused or mis-cued. Having said that, it does also raise some interesting ways to use the music to draw and shine parallels in areas where music was not previously used or can be replaced to hint at the narrative changes ahead.

In the end, I think I have pulled it off, but you will all soon be the judge and jury, hence the new subtitle "A Narrative Experiment". But don't let that lead you to think this has been "thrown" together. It has not; in fact, it has been technically and editorially the most difficult thing I have ever tackled. In fact, there were 3 sequences which almost broke me. I walked away from them, and continued to edit around them, and slowly, inspiration and serendipity shone their light.

Once this is submitted I will share what they were. The issues will then be self evident, though I believe I have solved them all. One is probably the most iconic sequence in the trilogy and it needed gargantuan musical and audio work to deliver on what I wanted while NOT ruining the scene AND still alter and do something new to it that served the non-linear structure and still be intelligible.

I must again apologize for being vague, but I really don't want to ruin this for anyone. I truly believe that even knowing what the ALL the reveals are in advance that this new structure will nevertheless provide a few additional surprises and revelations of their own. I certainly got a few surprises about elements that were sewn thru these that I had not connected. Hopefully, I have made them clearer. And of course, there is a new opening and a new ending. How could there not be?

It will be very interesting to see what your family and friends who may not have seen these (but are sitting with you watching since you own the underlying movies) make of it. Now that REALLY is of interest to me.

So, not long left, and as always THANKS to all the PM'ers etc and thread participant; your support is humbly acknowledged.

CIAO
"your families have lost their perspective"
 
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COUNTDOWN: 4...

2nd TEASER

TODAY !
 
Wraith said:
I nearly had a heart attack when 3/4s went out of sync....luckily I just replicated the error that caused it and it worked. AWFUL moment.

as far as the bit rate, as
Long as the rate I render at is greater than the source file, the program will copy all segments over that are lower and only render new sections, so it will effectively clone the source. It also speeds up rendering since only new portions (such as cross fades, zoom, pan and audio changes) are re rendered. On an edits as dense as this the impact on time to render is less, but it does still help. It also means that the image is as good as possible.

Compression introduces artefacts. In fact, each render is unique since the algorithm never render the same way twice . You try. The file size on two renders of the same thing will have different sizes once done. So I rarely pre render any material in an edit. On this one, the two credit rolls needed pre render since they were very very resource heavy and impacted the memory use of the program. The end credit roll has over 500 floating masks and 8000 words. The opening was fully hand animated for certain parts. Having them laid out as part of the edit slowed the program so much, that I would not have been able to complete this. Remember, we are all using domestic level hardware and software. I certainly can’t afford an AVID suite and the kit to run it….shame really. Maybe Patreon or crowdfunding?
Divorce would follow!
Click to expand...
Thanks for this explanation. Learned something new regarding the overall bitrate.
500 floatings masks…that’s insane, too

Haha, i suggest patreon. Your wife would cope with it^^
 
I liked the chosen dialogue for the teaser, made me smiling, despite that it wasn´t as exciting as i hoped for😅
 
SIUse said:
I liked the chosen dialogue for the teaser, made me smiling, despite that it wasn´t as exciting as i hoped for😅
Click to expand...
THANKS
Well, it's not as if you have not seen these....but it is just a tease....
 
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COUNTDOWN: 3...
and a QUESTION

There are no less than 63 changes and fixes I need to make to the edit following the first past review. That's in addition to the 6 major changes I made over the weekend to address a few anachronisms that remained and some further adjustments to the ending sound and music mix and further tweaks to the "handshake" scene and a couple more critical moments. These have to be spot on (as will everything else hopefully).

It is probably now going to take the rest of the week to get these changes done, and then we have the 2nd pass. This should hopefully yield very few changes.

- Locked 3hr 31mins ( 1 min less)
- First pass check completed (earphones)
- End credit roll composited and incorporated
- End credit roll music created from all 3 score CDs...all new
- Artwork, completed
- Trailer 2 : Completed
- Revise cut/add list - ongoing
- Corrections from 1st pass IN HAND
- 2nd pass review pending
- Submission pending

NOW, here is an issue:

Here are the original theatrical release dates of the 3 movies.
  • Unbreakable 2000
  • Split 2016
  • Glass 2019
I have a captioning problem, which I think is solved.

Unbreakable is set in either 1999 or 2000. Split is presumably set in 2016 or 2015. Glass we know is set very close to Split since Joseph relates to David early on that the "girls mutilated at the zoo 3 weeks ago" sets the film in the same year as Split (assuming that X-mas and New year did not occur in-between. Since there are leaves on the trees, we can assume that it is the same year. But which?

Well at the end of Glass Elijah states it took "19 years.".etc.... for the Beast to emerge. So if we assume that the year Split takes place in is the beasts first escapade, we add 19 years to 1999/2000 when Unbreakable occurs and we get either 2018 or 2019. So in fact, Split ends up being set 2 years after it was released. Which is fine.

I have elected to use 1999 and 2018 for captioning since it is visually more memorable than 2000 and 2019.

DOES THIS MAKE SENSE to everyone and have I missed something?
 
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^ ^ I see your question and your thought process has probably given you the correct answer but..........
Are you overthinking it? This is your edit, your Narrative. I suggest it can be what you feel is correct.
If the reference to "girls mutilated at the zoo 3 weeks ago" is still in your edit then that does tie the two films to the same calendar year.

You answered your own question in your question breakdown so the fact you have decided to use 1999 and 2018 seems spot on to me...
 
Thanks...I needed to check though, since I got the caption wrong on The Godfather by 9 years (1901 vs 1910) and the Lake Tahoe compound caption too, and had to re-render and re-post INCLUDING the 100gb worth of UBER files (which will soon need to come down to make room for this puppy).

I did over think it at an earlier stage but now that is all sorted out.
 
TEST FOR SPOILER RIDDEN ENTRY SHORTLY AFTER SUBMISSION DAY. All will be told (but needs to be avoidable).

Highlight to read:
SPOILERS TEST BELOW

SPOILERS: This is a test for SUBMISSION DAY. I will detail all the reasoning, changes and structure. Although the cut list will still be detailed on the submission IFDB page, it will hold back on sufficient details to ensure that anyone reading it will still get some surprises and revelations on how the edit is structured.

By posting the full details here, it is less likely people will find it by accident and they will have to highlight in order to read this in the future.

SPOILERS ABOVE TEST

OPEN
 
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COUNTDOWN: 2...

- Locked 3hr 30mins ( another min less)
- First pass check completed (earphones)
- End credit roll composited and incorporated
- End credit roll music created from all 3 score CDs...all new
- Artwork, completed
- Trailer 2 : Completed
- Corrections from 1st pass Completed
- 2nd pass review due following FULL RENDER
- Revise cut/add list - ongoing
- Submission pending

Took about 18 hours to make all the 63 tweaks and changes plus another half dozen additional tweaks that were not errors but on viewing as a whole, were clearly required.

Now, I get to watch this on a TV, in full, at full volume. This is likely where any volume issues will really emerge (not always so obvious on headphones, especially when watching in chunks). This needs to be a single pass view without touching the volume button on the remote.

Getting closer!
 
First render has so far taken 20 hrs to get 45% done....normally a 3hr movie will render in about 2-3 hrs. This is taking longer due to the very complex sound work and some complex visuals in order to be invisible. The good news is it all goes into a buffer so the next time I render, it only renders changes and builds them onto the prior render. So its going to be at least another day before I can do the TV review.

The Hobbit had a similar issue on FULL first render... 4 days !!!! Compared to Superman, all of which rendered in just over an hour! Godfather, 90 min...etc.

And my system is overclocked and on TURBO right now....
 
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