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Terminator 2 - Hands of Fate

I can confirm that the picture is perfect on my region A Skynet Edition blu ray. I'm having to make do with my TV's speakers at the moment, so I can't comment on the audio, but I doubt there would be a problem.
 
I know its relevant to the conversation and all.... but can we maybe take the discussion of different T2 official releases to a separate topic? :oops:

I'd love to hear anymore discussion of this actual edit here...
 
hehe, I know :) I just wanted to steer the conversation back to the edits direction. all is good. move along, move along...
 
Let me preface this review by stating that I am huge Arnold Schwarzenegger, James Cameron and Terminator fan. I have seen T2 dozens of times and have owned about 6 releases of the film over the years (currently 3 - ultimate edition dvd/xtreme edition dvd/skynet edition bluray)
This does indeed bias my review because many of my comments are tied to my love of the original film and how 'I would have done it' had I been the editor.
As always, no disrespect is intended. Only a constructive criticism and review.

!!!SPOILER WARNING!!!


First off, we have a DVD9 release, very nice. this allows for a complete release with all the bells and whistles of a commercial DVD. even without popping the disc in I know this is a cut above the normal fanedit DVD.

Upon start up we are greeted with a slick image of an Owl and the words "A ThrowgnCpr Production" with some nice bass groove. This is nice and adds to the production value IMO.
Then Bang! we get launched into a really fantastic menu intro clip in near HD quality followed by the interactive menu typed onscreen in terminator-vision. Amongst the options are more features than some commercial releases: play, chapters, bonus features, etc. each with a sleek motion transition to accompany the action. This is without a doubt the best fanedit menu I have seen all year.

The Main feature:
Technical: As mentioned before Throw chose to use the Ultimate Edition DVD as his source which was his only pitfall. The Ultimate edition released back in 2000 looks poor when compared to newer transfers/releases of the film. The image is blurry at times (on my 40" 1080p HDTV the white intro credits were very soft and showcased lots of color bleed) and looks less good than what we have seen in other transfers. It isnt what I would call unwatchable, but it looks worse than it should (or could) have. There were also instances of judder noticeable when slow camera pans across stationary objects occurred (see: the intro w/ flames on playground equipment and the fence at Pescadero) These observations aside, the picture was clear and stable throughout and was quite watchable.

The Edits: Many tiny changes have been made and I felt most were for the best. the addition of "Hands of Fate" where we normally see "Judgment Day" in the credits was masterful, my jaw dropped with jealous zeal when I saw it slam up with seamless integration. I dont know how Throw accomplished this but damned if it isnt beautiful.

Custom credits allowed 'fanedited by TC' another seamless integration.
The new bad to the bone scene makes me smile because other than the first time I saw the original I have always disliked the silliness of the scene. Throws reconstruction of the scene from the ground up is really something special even if it adds nothing to the narrative besides concealing the t-800's allegiance this time around. I did feel that the sound effects/dialog needed to be louder here though as they seemed (to my ear) a little low in the mix. but I'll take it, the score from T1 works wonders here and masterfully calls back to the original terminator film.

Removal of Robo-humor throughout helped the film but I think the editor should have gone further. the ''stand on one leg'' scene could do without johns "put your leg down" line and the smile scene is always painful to watch. its sooooo slapstick and fails to work for me every time. I know the point is to show the T-800 is learning but I still hate that horse face smile.

Other instances of audience winking/robohumor removal puzzled me (this is where 'I would have done it different' comes in)
The "model citizen" line from Silberman seemed to cut too late -I would have cut on sarahs face, rather than as Silberman begins to turn
The "Trust Me" Arnold line in Cyberdyne (I feel) cuts too late also, as we see John beginning to run to Arnold to stop him from killing humans. I would have cut earlier, but thats just me
I also felt the Kyle Reese dream sequence played funny. I wish I could better articulate my feelings here but i cant, something just felt off.

- I only raise these issues to better illustrate my personal bias. I feel it would be unfair to not explain where I am coming from even if personal bias is usually something you dont want in a review, a classic like T2 is impossible to remove bias from the equation.

Otherwise the edits are spot on and really benefit the film, I didnt for a second miss the "No Problemos" the "Chillout Dickwads" and the "Hasta La Vista Baby's" great work!

Custom end credits were very smooth, almost too smooth, and looked very crisp compared to the films intro text. I love the attention to detail by adding yourself in twice (that I caught) as well as the fanedit.org and ThrowgnCpr Produtions logos. very well done.
I was caught off guard when I saw my handle in the credits, I dont know what I did to deserve that honor, but I thank you all the same as it was a very pleasant surprise.

The Bonus Features: Wow, for a fanedit, theres a truckload of material here the featurette focusing on the sound reconstruction of the bad to the bone sequence is the crown jewel. its informative and interesting, well narrated and a great example of how fanediting can be used to alter/enhance a scene. Even though its a few minutes long IMO this is right up there with the commentary track on Attack of the Phantom. Required viewing for any aspiring editor.

Easter Eggs: great stuff from SNL/30 second Bunnies/GNR I havent seen the 'Toonces' skit or the 'You Could Be Mine' video in YEARS and never saw the '30 second bunnies' before. Nothing remarkable about this material other than its inclusion to round out a full package.

Overall this is a great package for Fanedit fans as well as Terminator fans. We get a great edit of a classic film and pile of features not previously released on the plethora of Terminator DVD's over the years.

Editing: 9 of 10 As I mentioned there were no technical issues in the editing only things I would have done differently
Entertainment: 9 of 10

Image & Video Quality:

Image quality was less than optimal. The source material wasnt the best choice but it was still enjoyable and not too distracting. some minor judder in certain camera pans.
Video Quality: 7 of 10

Audio Editing & Audio Quality:
Seamless, great editing from start to finish. my only quip is the levels on the reconstructed scene seem slightly low.
Audio Quality: 9 of 10
Audio Editing: 10 of 10

Presentation:
Best DVD authoring I have seen all year. Fantastic menu w/ full transitions. A truckload of extras and smooth near HD quality motion menus.
Presentation: 10 of 10

Final Result:
8 of 10 for me
A few minor issues hold this back from being a perfect edit but most are technical in nature and do not reflect on the editing and enjoyment of the film. This is a fantastic take on a classic and provides yet another option for us folks who have seen this film in 3 different versions (more if we count ADM/Tubes/Scaperat's edits ;) ) Required viewing for T2 fans.
 
I finally downloaded the DVD9 version and am burning it right now on a DVD9 (thus no shrinking ThrowgnCpr ). I won't have the time to check out the movie for thhis month (yep, I'm REALLY busy). However, I noticed how awesome your menu's are. How did you make them. You used the figures from the official DVD menu's but you mixed them some seamless. How did you do that? How did you remove the background from the looking endo? etc etc? It was an amazing menu intro.
 
give us your secrets! :x
:lol: :smile:
 
hehe, thanks for the menu kudos. well, there are no real secrets really. For the main menu, and bonus features menu, i made a screenshot of the endo, set that for the duration of the menu loop, and then applied all the layers over them, and animated. Aside from the text, they are almost all PNGs that were animated with pan/crop and keyframes. There were a ton of layers in each of the menus. Same basic technique for the bonus menu (using the "building the perfect arnie" trailer) i used a screenshot as the background (for the menu loop), applied a smoke layer over it with compositing, and used a combination of text and transparent PNG overlays. All of the menus had lots of layers, and a fair amount of compositing and keyframing. Though it was all done with a combination of Vegas and Photoshop. Nothing like After Effects was needed.
 
Alright, I finally watched this start to finish. First off, the A/V quality has been discussed plenty and all I will say is that it was as I expected. The concerns that have been raised are valid but it did not prevent me from enjoying the edit.

As far as the actual editing goes, I was very impressed. The cuts were logical and generally not noticeable (especially if you don't know what to look for). The reworked bad to the bone scene worked very well, and as was made obvious in the great bonus featurette, required a good deal of effort. I miss the "how's the knee" line but understand the reasoning. I really liked the trimmed first dream sequence. I kind of like the "model citizen" line but can understand why it went. Arnie's bike jump into the canal never bothered me that much but this edit handles it just fine (I agreed that it seemed obvious he was alreading heading down a slope and the jump wasn't necessary). No problemo, hasta la vista, need a vacation, thumbs up - all good cuts.

So all in all, I enjoyed this edit. It won't replace my Extreme DVD due to the A/V issues, but it was a worthwhile watch. And if Throw ever did a V2.0 with improved video and true 5.1? It would be a home run.

(unrelated side note to Throw - couple of PM's waiting for you. thanks :) )
 
Just watched this yesterday. I had intended to do an edit like this myself one day, and now I don't have to. I still find the film overly long, but I think you've done a very good job of making a more serious version of T2. I always found T2 held up the worst on repeat viewings in the whole series (including T3). I get why people are passionate about you changing things as this is one of those holy grail movies for some, but I think it's a technically sound and well made edit. I very much enjoyed your changes to the beginning sequence, much more reminiscent of the opening of T1. This will most likely be the version of T2 I watch from now on.

I also don't really give a crap about the fact that you used the ultimate edition as the source. It's not your fault that dvd didn't have a great transfer and you shouldnt have to buy a new copy of a movie you already own just to appease the video quality gods of fanediting.
 
The RS links are 100% dead for the DL version of this, for those who care to keep it shared. I would love to check it out if it wasn't offline.
 
There are MU links for the DL version. admins still haven't put them on .info since last September (hint, hint). I'll PM you the links.

FYI, I haven't really announced this yet, but I will be revisiting this edit, in HD sometime in the not-too-distant future.
 
ThrowgnCpr said:
FYI, I haven't really announced this yet, but I will be revisiting this edit, in HD sometime in the not-too-distant future.
:):):):):):):):):)
 
I'd like to jump aboard Frink's smiley train. :grin: This is excellent news!
 
ThrowgnCpr said:
There are MU links for the DL version. admins still haven't put them on .info since last September (hint, hint). I'll PM you the links.

They are now on info.
 
OK, after a stupid long time (I originally released this edit 4 years ago), this edit is available again - completely recut in 720p HD. See the first post for loads of updates.

The new version is very close to the first. I went over all the cuts though countless times to smooth things out, and made a few minor changes, including:


  • new "THX" intro
  • trimmed/reframed the scene where John teaches Arnie tricks in the parking lot. No more silly tricks.
  • recut the gas station scene to trim back some of the awkwardness. No more extra long Huey Lewis grin

For you SD folks, and those interested in all the goodies - I fixed a couple boo-boos on the DVD menus, and replaced the movie and the final trailer. Also available are 720p versions as MKV and AVCHD. Both are the same encode, just different containers. I encoded to fit on a DVD5 (because f$@k DVD9) which looks great.

I'll upload these starting Monday (Nov 18). Keep an eye out on info or PM me this week if you want links. Thanks to all who helped or provided feedback on this edit over the years, and an extra special thanks to [MENTION=4627]reave[/MENTION] and [MENTION=6348]TV's Frink[/MENTION] for being guinea pigs for the new HD version.

Below are video links for the DVD main menu & featurette as well an all new trailer. Enjoy.

DVD Main Menu:


DVD Fanedit Featurette (password: noproblemo):


all new HD trailer:


new cover art for BD case:
T2_AVCHD_3D_zps571e615b.jpg
 
I can say without reservation that this new HD version looks great, and I'm thrilled to see it completed. :)
 
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