Blade Runner: The Penultimate Cut (TM2YC)

[TM2YC]

Your info about the changes and audio sound great!

See if you can spot the subtle difference between the DVD colours and blu-ray colours during the unicorn dream :

I had a two-part question to pose about the unicorn footage that hadn't occurred to me before.

First, consistency-wise: in most areas, you're making the grading warmer and more naturalistic. Here, the Blu Ray (while washed out for sure) has actual green leaves and what just sort of appears to be a neutral background palette. The DVD/Regrading, while accurate to the original, seems to heavily push into the sepia, and it loses any color in the greenery.

Which leads to point two, which is really about effectiveness, rather than accuracy or intent. If this is an implanted dream, as implied by the origami later, should it be more natural and nature looking, or should it be just as polluted looking as the world Deckard lives in? The heavy sepia tint to me feels like the unicorn is in some amalgamation of nature and the urban hell that exists around Deckard. The clearer Blu Ray shot feels like it fits more in a dream, with elements of hope in the green. In the end I think it's more personal preference, but something to consider.

Personally, I wonder if there's some in-between. A more saturated version of the Blu Ray, keeping the greens, but perhaps still pushing the colors toward the DVD sepia. Or likewise, just bringing back some of the green tones under the sepia version.

Sticking to the original colours will be my default but I might change some things here and there. I don't like the washed out look of the dream on the DC blu-ray and I like the sepia tone but maybe something in between could work even better. I will be changing some shots for better colour consistency across sequences but not very often.

On another subject:

The harsh pink tint and aggressive contrast boost on the DC blu-ray for this shot of Pris was insane:

The noise in the image really calms down when the original colours slot back into place.

 

[TM2YC]

Here is Deckard entering the Bradbury building:

(Password: fanedit.org)

I've fine tuned the grade on the elaborate FX shot at the start (which featured at the end of the last clip). I broke it up into 8 layers so I could make sure all the elements of the composite had the correct levels of brightness, saturation and colour.

 

[Siliconmaster]

Nice work! Would you mind posting a full-frame comparison of that SFX shot compared to the original? There's so much detail and I'd love to be able to see all the pieces on the FC and here.

 

[TM2YC]

Nice work! Would you mind posting a full-frame comparison of that SFX shot compared to the original? There's so much detail and I'd love to be able to see all the pieces on the FC and here.

Sure. Here are a couple of frames: http://www.framecompare.com/image-compare/screenshotcomparison/20CMNNNU

It's mostly fixing the over saturated blue tint to the distance but things like the ever present dragon neon sign remain bright.

 

[Siliconmaster]

Interesting. I guess it's hard for me to adjust to the distant neon lights being more faded and yellow than the bright teal I'm used to. For me, I always saw that as a glow from the lights rather than an oversaturation on the whole image. Maybe it's the overall brightness of the distant lights, rather than the color, that's throwing me off. The DVD coloring really fades the brightness out.

 

[TM2YC]

Interesting. I guess it's hard for me to adjust to the distant neon lights being more faded and yellow than the bright teal I'm used to. For me, I always saw that as a glow from the lights rather than an oversaturation on the whole image. Maybe it's the overall brightness of the distant lights, rather than the color, that's throwing me off. The DVD coloring really fades the brightness out.

I had a double check and added back a little more saturation and a little less brightness to the far distance. Here is a frame from the shot from the DVD:

...and the same frame from the re-graded blu-ray:

When I do my ultimate cut thing, I'll be tweaking this shot. I might add back a touch more saturation and I'll be trying to get it to match the surrounding live action shots better. Plus I notice the smoke from the bottom live action element is breaking the matte line on the left hand side for a few frames (such as this one).

The shot I'm currently working on is going to be testing to get right. I've got it 80-90% there for the follow 1 frame, the last few percent for all frames is going to be the challenge because that beam of bright blue light moves all over the place:

http://www.framecompare.com/image-compare/screenshotcomparison/PGWGNNNX

Same from the DVD:

 

[Siliconmaster]

Awesome, nice work!

 

[The Scribbling Man]

I've seen this film so many times, but the gap between watching it on DVD and Bluray was quite large. Even so, I can't believe I didn't pick up on the stark colour differences until I came across this thread. Side by side, the blue of the current release is just disgusting, and so clearly washes away everything pleasing to the eye on the original grade.

Fairly recently a friend had me round, wanting to binge all the cuts of the film from his new 4k set - I agreed on 2, and watched the international theatrical and the Final Cut. Seeing it in context, I couldn't believe how ugly the Final Cut looked. I can't really comprehend why a grade like that could be approved over the original colouring - at least not to that extreme.

I'm not a big fan of the film, but I enjoy seeing your progress. It's excellent work.

 

[TM2YC]

I've seen this film so many times, but the gap between watching it on DVD and Bluray was quite large. Even so, I can't believe I didn't pick up on the stark colour differences until I came across this thread. Side by side, the blue of the current release is just disgusting, and so clearly washes away everything pleasing to the eye on the original grade.

Fairly recently a friend had me round, wanting to binge all the cuts of the film from his new 4k set - I agreed on 2, and watched the international theatrical and the Final Cut. Seeing it in context, I couldn't believe how ugly the Final Cut looked. I can't really comprehend why a grade like that could be approved over the original colouring - at least not to that extreme.

I'm not a big fan of the film, but I enjoy seeing your progress. It's excellent work.

Very interesting thoughts, thanks   and on the subject of the FC... I've really struggled to correct the above ^ pink shot from the DC blu-ray, so I got out my Blade Runner blu-ray set and went through all the versions to see what that shot was like in each. Turns out it's actually closest on the FC and not terrible on the workprint. It's only the DC (and branched cuts) that has that extreme pink tint in the scene.

Plus, all the cuts have a chapter point that begins on the Bradbury exterior FX shot above ^, so I could easily compare that shot too. The DC transfer has so much more detail than the FC, which looks very soft, compressed and lacking in grain but the FC colours are not as brightly blue as the DC.

Up to now I'd just assumed that the DC was the most correct colour wise because generally it is but perhaps for a few shots, this is not the case. So I might look into using the FC to tweak some shots where appropriate. I still wouldn't use it as the primary source for any shots/scenes because it's a comparatively poor/soft transfer overall.

 

[Flounder]

I personally loved the look of the Final Cut Blu-ray, but I'm really digging what you're doing with this. The regraded footage and shots look fantastic.

 

[LastSurvivor]

Looking good TMTYC... this is one edit I need to make sure I watch when it's released.  Appreciate the hard work going into this.

 

[TM2YC]

^ Thanks .

I'm making slow progress with that green/pink scene but I'm getting there. Here is the 2nd half of Deckard entering the Bradbury and going into JF's apartment:

(Password: fanedit.org)

 

[TM2YC]

So far, I've only needed to use elements from the Final Cut to fix this one shot from the pink sequence on the DC blu-ray:

Unlike other shots, I couldn't get anywhere near the original colours. I've also noticed how much the FC blu-ray is cropped, compared to the Director's Cut blu-ray. So I had to combine both.

 

[TM2YC]

I skipped ahead to have a look at the "tears in the rain" sequence, before doing more work on the Pris fight. Here is a comparison (the grade isn't perfect yet but it's close):

Man, the final cut sucks.

 

[asterixsmeagol]

I'm getting really excited to watch this version. Everything looks so crisp and clean.

 

[TM2YC]

I probably want to eventually replace the dove flying away shot. The original daylight shot was all wrong and the final cut version was an improvement but not quite right somehow in the way it looked. Is it too busy? or is the teal tint just making it look bad? Also, aren't they standing on top of the Bradbury when Roy lets he bird go, so how come after the dove flies up it's still lower than the roof of the Bradbury? I'd have to study the geography of the scene to be sure.

So I wondered what should that shot show? I looked up the Bradbury on street view and across the street is the taller "Million Dollar Theatre" which we see across the street as Deckard enters the Bradbury:

Here it is on Google streetview:

https://www.instantstreetview.com/@34.050718,-118.248308,346.99h,38.13p,0.34z

A VERY rough mockup of the new building in place:

 

[ChainsawAsh]

YES! The (or a) replaced dove shot with the DC DVD coloring is exactly what I was hoping for when you got to the end. The other FC FX changes I'm far less married to (though I like the replaced background in the Batty phone booth introduction), but the old dove shot is a deal breaker for me when it comes to Blade Runner projects. If you can make it even better than the FC's (admittedly not perfect) version and have it blend well with the surrounding footage, this will almost certainly be my definitive Blade Runner!

 

[Siliconmaster]

Yeah, I definitely support having either a CC version of the FC shot or a new one that still fixes the original. I can see why you feel it's a little too busy, but the pipes look a little too simplistic for me as well. Even some minor signage somewhere on them, or additional detail somehow, would help.

 

[TM2YC]

I can see why you feel it's a little too busy, but the pipes look a little too simplistic for me

I agree and I've already been looking into finding something to replace those. Something along these lines (again a VERY rough mockup):

I want to find some industrial chimney/smokestack photos that capture the form and shape of the original shot but with more detail. The photos also need to be 4K+-ish to have the level of surface detail that will look right, which limits what is available.

I won't be getting to this shot for quite some time, as I need to grade the last act of the movie first. Having the grade "locked" will be essential to judging the grade of the new shot.

 

[addiesin]

I can see why you feel it's a little too busy, but the pipes look a little too simplistic for me

I agree and I've already been looking into finding something to replace those. Something along these lines (again a VERY rough mockup):



I want to find some industrial chimney/smokestack photos that capture the form and shape of the original shot but with more detail. The photos also need to be 4K+-ish to have the level of surface detail that will look right, which limits what is available.

I won't be getting to this shot for quite some time, as I need to grade the last act of the movie first. Having the grade "locked" will be essential to judging the grade of the new shot.
[/quote]

You could start with an unconventional base that already looks tall, detailed, and weathered, like a photo of a lighthouse, and remove the top portion and add pipes to and around its structure.

You could also try to overlay a high-resolution material texture over different parts of a bland element in your image, to try to add some more perceived detail instead of replacing it entirely. Just get the perspective right on it.

Hope that helps.