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Batman and Robin: Deep Freeze (Yes, THAT Batman and Robin)

MusicEd921

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This was another secret project I had been working on. I wanted to make sure I could fully bring my vision for this to life and I think I'm on the right track.

If you're reading this thread, then you know what this movie is and why it killed the franchise for several years. After watching The Batman and getting into that noir world, I thought about what a polar opposite it was from Batman and Robin and then.....in some sort of fever dream.....I had an idea.

Let me start by saying that this movie is bad, so I'm not going to make this into the greatest Batman movie of all time nor am I going to cut away everything that was inaccurate to the comic books because I wouldn't even be left with a title sequence. This is also not an attempt to Burton-ize or Nolan-ize this movie. My approach is to find a middle ground which is more akin to the animated series. That is to say that this movie will be darker in appearance and little to no campiness in tone. Eliot Goldenthal's score will be lessened and replaced with music from the Arkham games. My reasoning for this is that, well when you hear Jaws, you think of Jaws and when you hear Shaft, you think of Shaft. When you hear Goldenthal's score, personally it takes me to visions of ice skating heroes and Mr. Freeze forcing his henchmen to sing songs while freezing.

Here are the overall plans that are in the works, but not the full cutlist:
-To tone down on the obnoxious colors, I'm converting it to black and white
-Replace as much Goldenthal score (at least his Batman theme) as possible with Arkham music
-ALL bad Arnold puns are gone
-NO BANE AT ALL (it's amazing how easy it was to cut him out completely)
-New opening featuring our heroes going after Freeze with intercutting credits
-Severely lessen the museum action sequence and remove ice skating heroes, dinosaur surfing and cheesy sound effects
-No rocket ship attempted getaway
-No Ivy origin or lab scenes
-Try to make Freeze a more sympathetic villain as his drive is to help his wife, not murder innocent people until he thinks his wife is dead
-Batman and Robin will bicker due to Ivy, but I'm working on taking away the trust issues
-The reveal that Ivy betrayed Freeze through a video recording will be edited so it is an audio recording Batman is playing for Freeze.
-Move some shots around because Freeze will not be Ivy's cellmate at the end. Instead, we'll see Ivy in Arkham and then I'm using an earlier shot of Freeze in Arkham holding an ice sculpture of his wife as I feel that is the perfect way to end his story.

Now, for a preview. This is not the final product as I want to adjust some of the darkness levels in there and mess around with some of the sound effects and foley a little more, but this is to give you a preview of my idea and where I'm going with this. This is going to take a while! These first 8-9 minutes took me 3 weeks! A big thank you to @Dwight Fry for giving this a preview yesterday as it gave me the motivation to even share that I'm working on this.

I hope you like my vision for Batman and Robin: Deep Freeze
Password: fanedit


By the way, I know I spelled Schumacher wrong!
 
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Gieferg

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Looks (and sounds - rescores is what brings my attention) interesting but I'd rather de-saturate and color-correct for different colors than going all the way B&W (which I personally don't like too much). It would be... I don't know... more interesting, and... demanding?

Also, not sure about those credits.
 

MusicEd921

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I'd rather de-saturate and color-correct for different colors than going all the way B&W (which I personally don't like too much). It would be... I don't know... more interesting, and... demanding?

Also, not sure about those credits.

Respectfully, that seems to all boil down to your personal taste and not really giving me something constructive to go on for what I am envisioning. This is also just a preview and not the final product.
 

Gieferg

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Respectfully, that seems to all boil down to your personal taste and not really giving me something constructive to go on for what I am envisioning.

Fanedits are personal taste. Commenting in the works edits is all about throwing ideas/suggestions left and right. I got some nice suggestions for my latest edit even if there were also suggestions that I didn't like - all based on personal tastes. Never said that something isn't constructive just because it wasn't what I wanted to hear because I consider ANY comment that brings ANY ideas to be valuable.

And the credits, in my opinion, break the flow and I found them to be rather distracting in that form - it felt more like trailer credits to me. Also, my personal taste, so you may say it's not constructive as well...
 
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MusicEd921

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Fanedits are personal taste. Commenting in the works edits is all about throwing ideas/suggestions left and right. I got some nice suggestions for my latest edit even if there were also suggestions that I didn't like - all based on personal tastes. Never said that something isn't constructive just because it wasn't what I wanted to hear because I consider ANY comment that brings ANY ideas to be valuable.

And the credits, in my opinion, break the flow and I found them to be rather distracting in that form - it felt more like trailer credits to me. Also, my personal taste, so you may say it's not constructive as well...
I understand that, but you didn’t exactly suggest anything other than to share that you didn’t like my ideas, which is fine, but then I’m not sure what the point was. There were no suggestions or ideas being thrown around.

I’ve seen lots of posts with ideas I didn’t like or were against my own taste, but I don’t say anything because I’m not the intended audience then. I’m not trying to make this a thing, but I have to admit that I felt a bit put off by your comments.
 

Gieferg

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There were no suggestions or ideas being thrown around.

Well, the idea was not about changing the whole project, more like a suggestion to expanding it - If I 'd be doing an edit with Black & White in mind, I would do it in color first (in this case - re-colored to be darker/less colorful than original), and then at the end of the whole process convert it to B&W to have two versions of it.

Someone asked me once for a version of one of my grindhouse edits but without fake film damage - never felt that he "didn't like my ideas", just suggested something else, so I gave him reasons why that won't happen (and there were a few). If not for these reasons, I'd probably do that. Some other time, there was an edit of GoT TV-to-movie but re-scored with LOTR soundtrack, the first idea was great, the other, not so much, but in case of such edit, there could be easily two separate audio tracks with and without re-score and, from what I know, that was done eventually.

So, the suggestion that maybe regraded version could be more interesting (for some), wasn't a statement that you should abandon your idea and do something that I'd like better, but more of a suggestion to consider an additional option.

And as for the credits - that dissolve effect doesn't fit well with retro-noir style IMO. Also, the movement of credits would fit better into classic opening Superman style, here, I'd see that in more minimalistic manner. And without movement, the inserted black screen with the credits could be a bit shorter.

other than to share that you didn’t like my ideas

Well, not really. Especially that most of them looks fine to me.

I didn’t like or were against my own taste, but I don’t say anything because I’m not the intended audience then.

So, do you prefer that people who are not completely on board with your ideas (even if they like some/majority of them) don't say anything cause they're "not the intended audience" anyway?
That would be quite surprising, but if that's the case I'll try to remember that and do not comment at all in such cases.
 
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Problem Eliminator

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This looks really good so far! I didn’t think it would look so good in black and white but it does. Lots of beautiful shots, which is surprising because I generally don’t think of Batman and Robin as a good looking movie, but your treatment has brought out something new in it.

My only suggestion - though I know the sound effects aren’t finished yet - is to beef up the engine sounds from the Batmobile and Robin’s bike.
 

MusicEd921

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This looks really good so far! I didn’t think it would look so good in black and white but it does. Lots of beautiful shots, which is surprising because I generally don’t think of Batman and Robin as a good looking movie, but your treatment has brought out something new in it.

My only suggestion - though I know the sound effects aren’t finished yet - is to beef up the engine sounds from the Batmobile and Robin’s bike.
Agreed! When I watched it on my TV I realized that there wasn't enough OOMPH to that engine and also the earthquake rumbling of the dinosaur falling over was severely lacking.
 

MusicEd921

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So, as for the credits - that dissolve effect doesn't fit well with retro-noir style IMO. Also, the movement of credits would fit better into classic opening Superman style, here, I'd see that in more minimalistic manner. And without movement, the inserted black screen with the credits could be a bit shorter.

Do you think a static shot of them fading in and out would work better? That was my original idea and then I played around with it on Vegas and thought maybe it added something. The blank screen is 1 second before and after each credits block, so maybe if I did a more static shot instead it would flow a little better. I'll give that a whirl and see how that feels/looks. It might mess with some of the timing of the shots though, but maybe not :unsure:
 

Gieferg

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Do you think a static shot of them fading in and out would work better?

Probably yes, but hard to be 100% sure not seeing it in context of the scene.
 

motleycat Enterprises inc

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Speaking of the credits, did Dwight Fry help you remove the credits from the frozen Bat emblem at the beginning?
 

Jrzag42

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Preliminary cuts have it clocking in at 85 minutes with credits.
That's way longer than the famous De-Assified edit, yet your edit sounds much more interesting to me. That's the most popular Batman and Robin edit, I'll definitely be curious to see how the two edits differ as far as what content you cut.

Anyways, the preview was fantastic. The one thing I'd like to suggest, when Mr. Freeze is freezing the guards, it cuts back and forth between him freezing them, and a shot of his face zooming in. But they do the zooming shot of his face a few too many times, it feels very "extra". I propose cutting it down to like, one cutaway to his face rather than four (or however many it is, I'm not looking at the clip right now). I remember that being a big moment that stuck out to me when I messed around with editing the movie a while back, I can't explain why the cutting back and forth annoys me so much.

One other minor thing actually, when Batman and Robin are knocked to the ground, they look at eachother and I believe it's at that point in the original movie where they then click their heels together to pop out the ice skates. Here the look at eachother for no reason, and it felt a bit awkward. Maybe it's fine and it only stuck out to me because I'm so familiar with the original.

As far as the credits, I think they work great, as does the rescore. I wasn't expecting the "Ice Man Cometh" line to be left in, but I absolutely respect keeping some goofiness here and there. I love Batman Forever, and I think Batman and Robin just goes too far in its silliness, but I don't inherently mind silliness. Also I love the black and white, it makes the movie look so much better.
 

Dwight Fry

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I don't mind "The Iceman cometh" myself. Sometimes the flow of a scene demands that the character says something in order to play well, and this is one of those cases IMO. One-liners are not always bad, one just has to know where to place them and when to stop. And of course, it's Arnold, he has to be allowed to keep one one-liner or two
 

MusicEd921

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I don't mind "The Iceman cometh" myself. Sometimes the flow of a scene demands that the character says something in order to play well, and this is one of those cases IMO. One-liners are not always bad, one just has to know where to place them and when to stop. And of course, it's Arnold, he has to be allowed to keep one one-liner or two
I purposefully chose to keep that one. He actually says it earlier to the frozen guards, but I felt it added a quick tension because he has the gun on Batman before Robin bursts in to save him.
 
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