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The Marvels
- Thread starter tremault
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While I enjoyed it, I think the issues with this movie are about timing and thematic resonance for some part, and foreknowledge of these specific characters as well. I really meshed with Kamala through the ms marvel series and what I saw here was a continuation of this that really worked for me. I did notice some real problems with some parts though, like the lead into the bollywood style planet thematically clashed with what came before. also, the part where Kamala's mother came on the screen, telling Kamala she can't go on missions in space, that really grated badly. The short scene with Tessa Thompson was really bad in my eyes too, it really did not work at all for me. There were other issues with timing such as when Carol was floating in space after the rift closed, there really needed to be more time for us to feel what she felt. there was also apparent foreshadowing that didn't pay off, such as how Dar'ben was using the bangle to interact with carol's powers but they never tried that with Kamala's bangle. That was perplexing. I also think Dar'ben's backstory really should have been a prologue.
Yes that seven-or so minute sequence was painful (and the part I really disliked) I thought of it as a more of a Disney world, than a bollywood thing -but with Carol literally being a Disney Princess. I wondered if it would be possible to cut in a way where they travel there and meet Yan almost immediately in a way where it doesn't seem too abrupt.
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I actually really loved it, I just thought it felt very inappropriate to have it at that moment. It seemed like it needed more of a lead up to it. I can't remember exactly what came immediately prior to it but I felt I was not ready for it and it took me a while to actually start to enjoy it.
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It's a shame the reaction The Marvels is getting. It's far from the worst MCU film (IMO that distinction belongs to Thor: Love and Thunder).
It's not without it's flaws, but I actually had a lot of fun with it!
Sure, the villain was underdeveloped, but I'd argue she got about as much development as Ronin The Accuser in the first Guardians.
This isn't a spoiler, but if I could change just one thing in the movie, it would be to replace the villain all together and bring back Jude Law as Yonn Rogg from the first movie. You wouldn't have to change the story at all and he'd immediately be more interesting solely for his history from the previous film. You'd actually barely have to change the script outside of the one flashback scene. He would slot in perfectly!
My other big gripe isn't really with the movie itself, but it's that this came out after Secret Invasion. I think the story of Secret Invasion would have benefitted tremendously if it had instead been a follow up to The Marvels,
It's not without it's flaws, but I actually had a lot of fun with it!
Sure, the villain was underdeveloped, but I'd argue she got about as much development as Ronin The Accuser in the first Guardians.
This isn't a spoiler, but if I could change just one thing in the movie, it would be to replace the villain all together and bring back Jude Law as Yonn Rogg from the first movie. You wouldn't have to change the story at all and he'd immediately be more interesting solely for his history from the previous film. You'd actually barely have to change the script outside of the one flashback scene. He would slot in perfectly!
My other big gripe isn't really with the movie itself, but it's that this came out after Secret Invasion. I think the story of Secret Invasion would have benefitted tremendously if it had instead been a follow up to The Marvels,
since the surviving Skrulls from the colony were rehomed on Earth, which makes NO SENSE after the events of Secret Invasion.
Editzilla
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Guardians didn't have any tension breaks at all. All the serious moments were portrayed as serious moments with weight. NWH on the other hand, went immediately from
addiesin
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Saw it, liked it. Not a ton to say about it. Not entirely standard plot, not 100 predictable the entire time, it worked for me. Pretty standard action and stakes and expectations. The fun tone of it does make Secret Invasion stick out more than it already did. I do feel like there was probably some kind of subplot that was cut out, I don't think the 90ish minute run time was entirely intentional, but I am glad it's that short, I hope more movies go back to that.
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I think the fact it's light, breezy and 'fun' are things that work against it. A lot of Marvel movies are like that and it's partially why the audience have tired of them.
Loki on the other hand was both fun AND driven by high stakes with a bittersweet ending that fed into the ongoing storylines of the present phases, and could easily have been the last movie of the year if they had bothered
Loki on the other hand was both fun AND driven by high stakes with a bittersweet ending that fed into the ongoing storylines of the present phases, and could easily have been the last movie of the year if they had bothered
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It’s a very okay film and that’s about all I have to say. I appreciate the brief runtime
addiesin
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A lot of recent Marvel stuff in theaters has been "improvvy" with how goofy a lot of the humor goes. Love and Thunder in particular, but it's not the only one. I think if their movies just had a light fun tone there wouldn't be a problem but that excess improvised dialogue stuff is cringe, but I don't think there's much of it in this movie. Even the goofiest scene in this film (Flerkin escape sequence) felt written and intentional as opposed to off-the-cuff riffing.
That said, dawg that Loki ending was Sooo good. They need to just do more of that kind of thing, but with everyone.
Hymie
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Watching the film, its clear that a lot was cut and the film was edited within an inch of its life to achieve the final product. As mentioned, the prologue about the Annihilator surely was originally intended as the opening of the film, and so much more was cut that there are blatant continuity issues (Kamala's clothes changing for no reason during the swapping scenes being a big one I believe). I enjoyed it enough, but it definitely needed another 7-10 minutes to let things breathe and for some character moments to shine through (Carol and Monica never got enough screen time to deal with their issues). It's just a shame how they've wasted Larson in the MCU and have really just fumbled the overall story telling of the MCU since Endgame.
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The Marvels was originally scheduled for a July 8, 2022 release, but kept getting moved back as they re-adjusted their movie release schedule. Apparently nobody bothered to think about adjusting the Disney+ schedule too.
WhatTheActualMark
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The movie was fun enough. If there's a fanedit incoming, I have this change:
Kamala recruiting Kate for Young Avengers should be the post-credits scene. The scene where Monica ends up in X-Men universe should be the after credits scene with the end title saying either "X-Men will arrive" or "The Marvels will return".
Or you can swap around and see how it works. That's just how I felt after watching the ending.
Kamala recruiting Kate for Young Avengers should be the post-credits scene. The scene where Monica ends up in X-Men universe should be the after credits scene with the end title saying either "X-Men will arrive" or "The Marvels will return".
Or you can swap around and see how it works. That's just how I felt after watching the ending.
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Ok! I just came back from watching the movie, dreading the worst from what I've kept hearing from people and hoping that it won't be that bad! And thankfully my hopes weren't unfounded because this movie, indeed, ended up being passable! Hooray!!! ...sigh...
Okay so jokes aside, yeah I had a lot of fun with this, and I'm glad to see a lot of people agreeing here too that it's not as bad as people made it out to be. I think this is just a case of bad timing where the fun aspect doesn't really deliver anymore, because people are just so damn tired at this point of their output. But I'm BAFFLED at how anyone can say it comes anywhere close to being as bad, let alone worse, than something like Quantumania or arguably She-Hulk.
Although there is one aspect of the film that DID massively disappoint me, and that was the music. I wasn't expecting anything spectacular, but the complete absence of Pınar Toprak's amazing Captain Marvel theme that we had from Captain Marvel to Ms. Marvel (or even small references in other works) PLUS the new generic-ass theme they brought in, was HEARTBREAKING to me (especially as a fellow Turk lol but that's neither here nor there.) Why does Marvel SUCK so much with this? Do they not own the rights to these themes? Is it a legal issue, when they bring in a new composer they have to pay for the legal rights of the previous theme to use it again or something? Then why does that not apply to Spider-Man 3 and Christopher Young replacing Danny Elfman for example? I... I'm at a loss!
I have a more detailed review here:
letterboxd.com
Hundred percent, I couldn't have put it better myself. Though I thought the movie had a much more consistent tone than something like Love and Thunder, a lot of times going from the relatively more dramatic scenes to the balls to the wall ridiculousness the movie had (which most people hated but I loved by the way, not a lot of movies have the balls to embrace the silliness like that!) was a little jarring.
But I won't lie I absolutely loved whenever we cut back to Kamala's family, which I knew you weren't much of a fan of.
I'd say that it's less about things that work against the film itself and more the general fatigue that people have had with this franchise, and speaks of a larger problem of a lack of effort and care they seem to be putting that this kind of movie being a benchmark of quality is kind of depressing (Loki notwithstanding!).
And I think the problem with this specific movie is not that it's light breezy fun, but more so not having a structured, nuanced enough story (still can be simple!) to accompany it, even if the characters relationships and arcs were well done in my opinion (I mean what does it amount to? Not much honestly) But I think we're on the same page on that regard anyway.
Okay so jokes aside, yeah I had a lot of fun with this, and I'm glad to see a lot of people agreeing here too that it's not as bad as people made it out to be. I think this is just a case of bad timing where the fun aspect doesn't really deliver anymore, because people are just so damn tired at this point of their output. But I'm BAFFLED at how anyone can say it comes anywhere close to being as bad, let alone worse, than something like Quantumania or arguably She-Hulk.
Although there is one aspect of the film that DID massively disappoint me, and that was the music. I wasn't expecting anything spectacular, but the complete absence of Pınar Toprak's amazing Captain Marvel theme that we had from Captain Marvel to Ms. Marvel (or even small references in other works) PLUS the new generic-ass theme they brought in, was HEARTBREAKING to me (especially as a fellow Turk lol but that's neither here nor there.) Why does Marvel SUCK so much with this? Do they not own the rights to these themes? Is it a legal issue, when they bring in a new composer they have to pay for the legal rights of the previous theme to use it again or something? Then why does that not apply to Spider-Man 3 and Christopher Young replacing Danny Elfman for example? I... I'm at a loss!
I have a more detailed review here:
A ★★★ review of The Marvels (2023)
When Marvel's track record has been so low and people are so tired of their output recently, (even when a rare gem like Loki comes out) when something like the Marvels comes out where all it offers is purely ridiculous fun, of course people aren't going to be won over by it. But I, going into...
letterboxd.com
Hundred percent, I couldn't have put it better myself. Though I thought the movie had a much more consistent tone than something like Love and Thunder, a lot of times going from the relatively more dramatic scenes to the balls to the wall ridiculousness the movie had (which most people hated but I loved by the way, not a lot of movies have the balls to embrace the silliness like that!) was a little jarring.
But I won't lie I absolutely loved whenever we cut back to Kamala's family, which I knew you weren't much of a fan of.
I'd say that it's less about things that work against the film itself and more the general fatigue that people have had with this franchise, and speaks of a larger problem of a lack of effort and care they seem to be putting that this kind of movie being a benchmark of quality is kind of depressing (Loki notwithstanding!).
And I think the problem with this specific movie is not that it's light breezy fun, but more so not having a structured, nuanced enough story (still can be simple!) to accompany it, even if the characters relationships and arcs were well done in my opinion (I mean what does it amount to? Not much honestly) But I think we're on the same page on that regard anyway.
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WhatTheActualMark
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There is an odd deleted scene that I assume takes place in the first act. Valkyrie calls Carol but sees Kamala and assumes she's married again. Then there's a miscommunication between "strap-on" and "strap-in". Maybe you can remove the creepy jokes to help pad out the runtime.
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Now on DisneyPlus.
Not sure why this movie garnered so much negativity, as it is a genuinely charming movie.
While it continues Marvel recent tonal shift to emphasize comedy over drama, at least here, it is not at the detriment of the plot or characters. None of our heroes are turned into idiotic buffoons like in Ant-Man 2 and Thor 4. It is far, far, very far, from being the "worst Marvel movie" as some critics have described it.
After being reserved and stoic in her first outing, Brie Larson is allowed to shine and display the charisma that has made her such a stand-out in other movies. Iman Vellani is the heart of the movie, bringing so much joy to the proceedings. And Teyonah Parris is the grounding glue that holds the story and characters together.
Is the villain under developed? Yes. It is still a Marvel movie. But for me, the relationships between our three heroes more than makes up for it.
While the "Musical Planet" and "Cat Gobbling" may be a step too far, I must admit those scenes did make me laugh. And smartly, the movie does not linger too long on those moments, and never loses sight of it's stakes and consequences.
While I will not say it is a return to form for Marvel, it is a step in the right direction. A fun flick.
Not sure why this movie garnered so much negativity, as it is a genuinely charming movie.
While it continues Marvel recent tonal shift to emphasize comedy over drama, at least here, it is not at the detriment of the plot or characters. None of our heroes are turned into idiotic buffoons like in Ant-Man 2 and Thor 4. It is far, far, very far, from being the "worst Marvel movie" as some critics have described it.
After being reserved and stoic in her first outing, Brie Larson is allowed to shine and display the charisma that has made her such a stand-out in other movies. Iman Vellani is the heart of the movie, bringing so much joy to the proceedings. And Teyonah Parris is the grounding glue that holds the story and characters together.
Is the villain under developed? Yes. It is still a Marvel movie. But for me, the relationships between our three heroes more than makes up for it.
While the "Musical Planet" and "Cat Gobbling" may be a step too far, I must admit those scenes did make me laugh. And smartly, the movie does not linger too long on those moments, and never loses sight of it's stakes and consequences.
While I will not say it is a return to form for Marvel, it is a step in the right direction. A fun flick.