The Hobbit: There and Back Again, Part 1

[Menbailee]

Faneditor Name:Menbailee
Tagline:2-Hour Barefoot Edition
Original Movie Title: The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey
Fanedit Type: FanFix

Original Release Date: 2012
Original Running Time: 169
Fanedit Release Date: August 2013
Fanedit Running Time (Min): 121

Time Cut (Min): 48


Brief Synopsis:
I set out to create a leaner, cleaner first part to The Hobbit. I do not demand purism relative to the book; instead, I insist on solid storytelling. Although I've cut most sequences that looked outright ridiculous, I kept Radagast and several other features that don't appear in the book or are more directed toward children, but which contribute to the story. Azog is gone, save only in an appearance as the angry orc in pursuit of Thorin & Company after the death of the Goblin King, the flashbacks are much condensed and differently placed, Frodo is gone, and we are left with a quicker and more magical return to Tolkien’s famous novel.


Intention:
As soon as I watched The Hobbit, it became my highest fanedit priority. As might be expected for a thin book expanded into three long films, An Unexpected Journey turned into a bloated and muddled mockery of the grandeur we remembered from Jackson's Lord of the Rings. The Hobbit got mired in set pieces, and it thematically undermined Bilbo's story with his violent involvement in the superfluous White Orc plotline. Meanwhile, scenes like The White Council or the Stone Giants provided something of a snoozer but advanced the plot not one whit.

I aimed to improve pacing, to attain greater thematic consistency with Tolkien’s Hobbit, and to remove some laborious absurdity, all while keeping the movie hopefully in continuity with the future films--or at least an edited version thereof.


Additional Notes:
I use the Blu-ray as my source. I am not encoding to Blu-ray at this time for reasons of file size and convenience. For the DVD release, I am offering both a version with hardcoded letterboxing (which is the standard on most DVDs), and also a version with the full 720x480 pixels filled, for which the aspect ratio can either be corrected manually, or simply allowed to fill the entire screen with a slight stretch to the image.

Other Sources: None.

Special Thanks:
TM2YC for feedback, a beautiful cover, and a reworked matte that I used for the final shots of a more distant Erebor. Also my thirteen friends and my girlfriend who attended the screening party for the first completed workprint.

Release Information

• NTSC DVD-5
• MP4/M4V/MOV

Special Features: None in current release.


Change List

Reveal message

Prologue flashbacks truncated and re-ordered to make dwarves more sympathetic, and moved to where Bilbo learns the story during the unexpected party. A few establishing shots are altered to fit the scenes into context.

Frodo cut

Dwalin/Balin head bump cut

Some extra shots of dwarves being messy cut

Redundant Thorin & Gandalf dialogue cut

Gandalf's exposition on Bilbo's thoroughly unremarkable childhood cut

Thorin & Balin's conversation after "it appears we have lost our burglar" cut (shot of Thorin reversed so that he is look toward Bilbo instead of away)

Misty Mountains song uses footage excised from the flashbacks, converted to slow motion, to create a montage.

Entire Pale Orc plotline cut--this involved many cuts throughout the movie, starting with the flashback after Fili and Kili tease Bilbo

The dwarves no longer have a silly fight scene with the trolls only to throw down their weapons for a companion they don't even like. Instead, they charge the trolls, and we cut directly to their cooking over the fire. Clearly the charge was a well-laid plan. (Finagling the audio for this cut was the biggest pain in the rear for the edit; I doubled and reversed the battle cry to avoid sounds and music on the center track.)

Troll banter on seeing Gandalf cut

Radagast stays! He sets up the Necromancer plot for the next movie. However, his appearance to Gandalf happens after Rivendell rather than before, and Gandalf is implied to separate from the dwarves with him. A shot back to the sword helps explain what Gandalf has just received.

The entire warg chase scene is cut.

Thorin's concern that the elves will stop them cut (but mistrust kept)

Elrond's skepticism concerning the Erebor quest cut

White Council removed entirely. Ugh.

Stone Giants cut. Blerg.

Fall down goblin hole made less ridiculous

Goblin King trimmed

Every single frame of Gollum kept!

Goblin chase scene cut from five minutes to one. This involved many small cuts.

Many small cuts reduce the Pale Orc from a nemesis of Thorin's to the Really Angry Orc who pursues them after they killed the goblin king. The dwarves and Bilbo do not leave the tree once chased up. The Eagle rescue has also been trimmed; they do not fight the wargs except to drop a tree on several. Our only explanation for Thorin's KO is that falling from trees and eagles can be rough on a dwarf; this is the only significant continuity issue for which I could not find a fix.

Bilbo becoming accepted as a DwarfBro cut

Erebor mattes replaced to suggest a greater distance from the mountain--thanks to TM2YC for creating the modified matte I used for this

Ending credits music modified...

The edit should be available on .info soon--until it is, feel welcome to PM me for links.

 

[geminigod]

Menbailee, congrats on completing this and being the first Hobbit edit to be released (that I am aware of). I definitely plan on checking out your version with the proper aspect ratio, but I must ask why you are releasing this other version? Based on the screen capture displayed on the home page news section, the aspect ratio appears to be extremely distorted. I would appreciate it if you shared your thoughts on why you are releasing both?

 

[Menbailee]

Thanks, Geminigod! The DVD that I expect most people to download includes letterboxing in the video file, as do most commercial widescreen DVDs, in order to achieve the original aspect ratio.

I used the Blu-Ray as my source, so I'm also releasing a version that achieves slightly higher video quality by using all 480 vertical pixels available to the DVD format. Enough TVs or players have aspect ratio options these days that viewers can adjust this manually and still have the pixel advantage on an HD screen. Some people also prefer an image that fills their screen, even if the image is stretched. The 720x480 pixel version is an alternative for either of these audiences. The video on the news page, which is something I made in-process to show how the interminable goblin chase scene could be reduced to one minute, is in this format.

The mkv file will only be released in the original aspect ratio.

Incidentally, a big thank you to Aztek463. Both my computer and my external hard drive got fried the very day after I submitted the edit to IFDb, and while I'm futzing with makeshift hardware Aztek kindly generated the .dlc file so that the edit can be available through .info.

 

[Aztek463]

Any time! I'm more than happy to help a fellow editor.

I haven't viewed the edit in its entirety, but the bits I took a look at on my TV (burned to a DVD) look gorgeous. Now, I've always found that DVD edits sourced from a Blu-ray have always looked nicer than ones sourced from a DVD. With that in mind, I don't think that you're going to get much more of a picture difference making use of the full 480 resolution: I have an inkling most everyone here will correct it anyways, and by the time it does get corrected from disc to screen, I think the difference in quality will be negligible. But hey, more power to you for trying something different.

 

[geminigod]

Both my computer and my external hard drive got fried the very day after I submitted the edit to IFDb,

OMG, that sucks!

so I'm also releasing a version that achieves slightly higher video quality by using all 480 vertical pixels available to the DVD format.

I think I understand your logic but don't agree with it. I'll PM you.

 

[TV's Frink]

Were I to know nothing about this edit, I wouldn't correct the issue on my TV, I would more likely stop watching and report it here.

I still think it's not a good idea, and I would consider only offering it via PM and not on info.

 

[Menbailee]

Were I to know nothing about this edit, I wouldn't correct the issue on my TV, I would more likely stop watching and report it here.

I still think it's not a good idea, and I would consider only offering it via PM and not on info.

I'm going with Frink's suggestion and will offer only the letterboxed DVD on fanedit.info. That's the version I've been distributing so far, and I'll keep it that way. We faneditors tend to treat alteration to the aspect ratio as sacrilege, whereas enough viewers like the alternative for me to provide it--but not on the main site!

 

[duckofchaos]

Having just finished watching this edit, I have to say you did a pretty wonderful job. The far-too-stretched-out original movie has a much nicer pace to it, and nearly all of the problems i had with the original movie have been removed. putting the slowed down flash backs during the misty mountain song was a stroke of genius.

I cant wait to see what else you will change when you revisit this after the extended edition and the Desolation of Smaug comes out. Since you already plan on revisiting this edit, I have an idea for a slight change to the way you did the flashback sequences at the dinner table. I'll PM you the suggestion and my reasoning, no sense cluttering the forum.

 

[baldie2k12]

Just about to burn to disc, will leave a review after viewing it this evening.

 

[RollWave]

I have an idea for a slight change to the way you did the flashback sequences at the dinner table. I'll PM you the suggestion and my reasoning, no sense cluttering the forum.

some would argue that posting and discussing ideas is the whole purpose of the forum, and that the contents of your pm would be the only thing here that is not clutter.

 

[Vultural]

Second RollWave.
Place your suggestion on open forum so voices can weigh in.

 

[Menbailee]

some would argue that posting and discussing ideas is the whole purpose of the forum, and that the contents of your pm would be the only thing here that is not clutter.

Agreed! Your suggestions via PM were definitely signal and not noise. His idea was basically to cut Smaug's attack on Erebor and show the flashback only up through the destruction of Dale. I considered permutations of this idea, since he's right that even my considerably cut down version of the flashbacks is still several minutes long. When I return to the edit next year, I'll look for more ways to trim, but I like Smaug's attack enough that I won't chop it entirely. The Arkenstone won't play a role until the third movie, but it's useful to seed things like this subtly and early.

One thing that puzzles me about how some people view the original movie is to interpret Thranduil as bringing his army to fight Smaug, then changing his mind. Since this doesn't make much sense, some people wanted it removed. But the attack on Erebor is in progress at that moment; there's no way a messenger has even reached Rivendell, much less an army raised to fight a dragon. Thranduil arrived with his retinue to pay homage as usual, found the dwarves no longer rich and powerful, and then refused even to aid the refugees. It's a betrayal big enough to merit Thorin's feelings later, so I didn't change this.

Some of it has been arriving via PM rather than the board, but I've been appreciating the reviews and feedback so far.

EDIT: I wish that reviews from the main page automatically wound up here, since I'd enjoy discussing what I'm seeing there. My greatest point of pride may now be that the edit has passed the Ten Year Old test: a kid liked this version better than the original. By removing many juvenile elements, I intended to make this movie more kid-friendly. Kids are not dumb.

 

[PrincessHangry]

One thing that puzzles me about how some people view the original movie is to interpret Thranduil as bringing his army to fight Smaug, then changing his mind. Since this doesn't make much sense, some people wanted it removed. But the attack on Erebor is in progress at that moment; there's no way a messenger has even reached Rivendell, much less an army raised to fight a dragon. Thranduil arrived with his retinue to pay homage as usual, found the dwarves no longer rich and powerful, and then refused even to aid the refugees. It's a betrayal big enough to merit Thorin's feelings later, so I didn't change this.

I will admit, this was my original interpretation of Thranduil's army involvement. I thought, upon first viewing the original, that perhaps he was angry at the Dwarves for being so materialistic, and took this as an opportunity for them to learn painfully about the perils of being greedy or something. However, your explanation makes a significant amount more sense- and his refusal to aid the refugees explains Thorin's feelings. That was not well explained in the original, and I'm not sure there is enough footage to piece together that story in the recut. I wonder if there's some other way to provide the exposition, like, perhaps a flashback to the scene where he pays homage, at the moment of refusal to aid?

 

[winzentween]

hi, everyone seems really impressed but where can I view this great undertaking please ???

 

[ThrowgnCpr]

hi, everyone seems really impressed but where can I view this great undertaking please ???

check the rules and info on how to use this website. that should help.

 

[winzentween]

hi i already did and it says look elsewhere but i have looked on torrents sites and in google and used pm and got no where :? it seems a shame as after all the hard work surely the idea is to share it though i can see how this is not black and white.
If maybe someone could pm me with something that be great.
Eitherway good work regardless if i ever see it lol

 

[Neglify]

PM sent.

 

[winzentween]

OK, sooooo I just watched the fan edit so firstly thank you to those who helped me find it and secondly thank you to all involved in the edit and lastly thank you to all that made it possible and that includes mr jackson.

What did I think?
Well I had not seen it since the cinema which I thought was an excellent film disguised as a bloated continuous action scene for small and rather dumb children but the good news is some how it has become an excellent film again lol
We all know The Hobbit is a children's book but we fans of the lotr, even those of us who were children when it came out are all now adults so we don't care about children and fart jokes and jar jar, we want something mature and intelligent for the most part and There and Back again achieves this result admirably whilst retaining that child like quality of wonder and adventure and exploration which all good fantasy should contain.

I cannot quite remember the original but I know it was too long, too action based, too much cgi, too much silliness, too much departure from the book, to much lower common denominator humour so basically Phantom menace syndrome strikes again lol
though as previously stated there was excellence, a diamond in the rough as it were and the editor has kindly polished this precious gem though I will point out the few flaws I found later.

I loved the LOTR trilogy as it is the pinnacle of its type and such a staggering achievement for all involved but Jackson has fallen to the CGI god which enslaved Lucas and we saw it in 'From Hell' and then 'the lovely bones' and ofcourse to a new low in 'the hobbit' but that evil smelling ugly spirit too has been vanquished from this film via the edit.

What I think you did (what I noticed):

The loss of that ridiculous opening action cgi scene with the dragon = thank god it was shifted to its rightful place!
The removal of frodo =wtf was he in it for lol he has 3 of his own films totalling 9 hrs, get the hell out of dodge!
The dinner scene seemed less 'bad' (more later) and now a very clever combo of the opening scene to perfectly compliment the setting up of an adventure,/ road movie/ heist film(people forget the hobbit is a bank robbery). Your reworking really was genius and nearly perfect in execution and surely a masterclass in story telling which Jackson should take note of (high praise indeed).
All the warg and white orc nonsense removed, as it was an ugly confusing pointless addition to flesh out the film with yet more bad cgi and endless action. Though white orc appears briefly at the end (and seemingly out of context though there was the elf lord mention of orks).
The removal of the meeting of the minds lol what a load of tosh to connect the trilogy by placing all those ageing stars together again to the delight of fans but the detriment of the film. Good riddance to extended exposition I say! The link to the next 3 films is gandalf and that is what was intended and to a lesser extent bilbo but certainly not all the rest. Though the evil of Sauron returning was fine to a point and explained all the increased evil activity.
The removal of the yet another pointless action scene based on a few lines about storm giants fighting, which dragged on and on till my head was screaming for the misuse of cgi = best left as an extra.
The cutting short of the goblin chase scene and the removal of the goblin king demise. This action scene also went on and on and was really the burden which broke the camels back and just far too self indulgent and padded and basically another one of those scenes only enjoyed by children under ten... on ritalin.
The end battle scene and possibly the death of the white orc? (cannot remember).

The fact that my usually excellent cinefile memory cannot remember much of this film is because it was ultimately forgettable.
Im sure there was more but off the top of my head that is what was missing or done.
Nearly all of your choices worked and made sense and were nec. to a degree to retain the flow of the book and the feel of the LOTR film trilogy. Your edit has made a far tighter and more enjoyable film closer to the (far closer) original intention of the author so well done again.

What I did not like / further cuts / inclusions:

Add real smoke and loose cgi smoke (WHY !!!) though I know you cannot do this it stands out a mile and is on par with cgi blood.
There were some sync issues with audio in the first few dinner scenes which never came back.
The cuts to make the flashbacks work were not perfect (but this all may be due to the limited material). The less is more with any of the extended cgi material.
The dinner song was never to my liking but very in keeping with the lighter tone though it could be shorted further.
Bilbo joining the party seemed a little too upbeat (maybe extended cut will help).
The troll scene is so 'very' basic to begin with but I would cut out the voice of the jar jar character making stupid remarks and infantile noises and toilet humour gags and omg why do we have to make our children into morons too!!!
They seem to just end up in elf town after saying they did not want to go which seems weird but possibly that is an issue with the original material (and like much of the actual story telling and plot holes the extended may fill it).
I love and hate all the hedgehog and spider rabbit sledge dr who madness but certainly the entire visit to the old castle could be shortened and YOU must remove that god awful cgi spirit moaning zoom rush shot, of presumably Sauron returning.
There is nothing worse than when things r near the camera for 3d effect or monsters have unrealistic abilities or we have zooms to gnashing mouths. I think we get a bat doing the same cheesy cgi 3d nonsense a few secs later so loose one keep the other.
I would have like to have seen the goblin scene extended as that is a flesh and bones climax (if the orc end is also shortened).
Cut the weird bit with the goblin whose head falls off (far too much head lopping in films without geysers of blood; how has this become standard, ok or even funny??).
I think you need that goblin king showdown to give the film a villain who is defeated and I know that in the book this was not even an issue unless u consider the wolves but the cgi wargs r so bad it is not the same feeling as seeing a giant goblin get its head cut off.
I would loose the wargs all together but u cant and u have a done a great job as it is but the dwarf boss being hurt out of the blue is plausible but a little out of place and maybe could be lost altogether if we r not to see bilbo SAVE HIM etc.

Sooo it makes perfect sense to end the film with the goblin king show down as that is a good death scene and then have your brief warg battle but with no damaged heroes and then cut to them on the cliff followed by smaug waking up = ePIC!!!
Currently your version as previously alluded to , is a perfect opening segment but as a result seems now slightly too short and incomplete as a stand alone film, due to the removal of a real ending which involves some character dev and a baddie death (or 2 or 3) and though we get bilbo's brief but lovely speech, it is not quite enough to bring it full circle.
What we have now is a rather short but perfect first part to the three and if the same wonders r worked will end up with 2 films in total as was the original plan but the quality will be on par with the first trilogy. Actually what you have done is similar to the fellowship before the extended and has that same open ended theme.

I am sure there is more and you have many of your own ideas but keep at it as you have literally saved this film and I dread to think what the extended will be like and how you will tackle it if at all.

The funny thing is the LOTR extended was awesome as you had a great film made better but when you have an average film with lots of junk and you extend that , well you get more junk or junk with more to it but its a polished turd and not the diamond you have given us.

I firmly believe that fanedits r now the future as film makers (perfectly good ones!) have lost the plot and sabotage their own efforts due to greed, studio pressure, interference and age and that is when the able fans step in and assist these vets. to realize their dreams. The hobbit had a very trouble dev. so im not surprised it isnt perfect but it is that one step closer due to this and future edits.

 

[Menbailee]

Thanks for your thoughts Winzentween, and also to the other folks who've posted reviews on IFDB. It's good to see that most people are sharing my experience of the edit, which is to say of an awful movie made into a fun one, with a few points left very difficult to fix.

Remember when we were kids, and most movies were about 90 minutes? I want each Hobbit film to stay on the short side, but I'm hoping that the extended edition gives us a few scenes worth including, even if just as much (or more!) of the theatrical cut stays out. I'm also hoping against hope that I get just a few shots that allow me to avoid showing an injured Thorin, since there's just no reasonable way to justify that injury without showing the combat with the pale orc. I want to avoid that if at all possible.

The hate for the dishes scene doesn't cease to surprise me. It's in the book, it's in Rankin & Bass, and it's a an effective playful juxtaposition against the somber arrival of Thorin.

I understand the hate for Radagast, on the other hand, but he's certainly staying, since he's clearly necessary to the subsequent movies, and I actually enjoy the characterization of the wizard who is so close to nature that he's only marginally conversant with people anymore. The point about little shots that were mainly made to rear their ugly heads in 3D effects is well-taken, however, and some little snips here and there may happen yet.

I sure wish I could cut those obnoxious trolls down more, though. They aren't funny, but the visual continuity in the scene is rather delicate, so there are limits on what I could accomplish. Similar principles apply at other moments I might otherwise cut.

I'm expecting other recuts of The Hobbit to emerge in the coming years, and I'll be curious to see how we learn from each others' solutions to the problems in these movies.

 

[TV's Frink]

Better update your sig.