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Good high quality video editing?

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TeresofBlood

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I'm looking for a cheap editor with high quality results(if there is such a thing). I was wondering if anyone could make some suggestions. I would like a full editing program, as opposed to the free basic chopping tools posted around here.

I was looking at Ulead Video Studio and Media Studio and Pinnacle Titanium... things of that nature. I have a nice DVD authoring program, so I'm not worried about that. I just need something I can import an MPEG or an M2V, edit, add transitions, etc and export to High quality MPEG2. Any thoughts or suggestions.

I'm an experienced editor, but my experience is working with DV and DVC-PRO and capturing. I've never done much with MPEGs, so I'm sort of a layman when it comes to these free programs with tools too basic for me to figure out(if that makes any sense). I can't figure out how to use most of them. I would like something a bit more user friendly.
 
All I have used to any length is Pinnacle, but I do reccomend it for light editing and stuff. The thing I love about it is how user-friendly it is. You can pretty much dive right in without the countless hours of acclimation programs like Adobe and Vegas require. But the trade-off is less options when it comes to advanced stuff. For instance, in the version of Pinnacle I have you can't put a clip in reverse (a handy tool). That's all I can recall not being able to do with it, but it lacks stuff like LookSuite and those kinds of things.
 
All I need it for is cutting clips together, and perhaps adding fades to some areas. I don't need it to build titles and I have tools to reverse footage. As long as the export quality allows for excellent MPEG2 quality. I'm using dual-layer so size isn't important.

Thanks for the help though. I'm leaning toward Pinnavle, because it's an offshoot of Avid, which is what I use to edit original footage.
 
The thing I dislike about Pinnacle is their mpeg machine. It produces no good quality. So what you have to do if you work with pinnacle is you EITHER need a frameserving tool, so you can use avs and tmpgenc for the encoding OR you need to save in the best possible quality on constant bitrate and re-encode with tmpgenc. Still the result will look better than working with the mpeg engine of pinnacle on bitrate settings below 7000kb/s.
 
Thanks for the tip. How would I use those as a frameserver(I don't even know what a frame server)? How would I get the edit out of Pinnacle w/o exporting it.

I just did a test export with Ulead VS10 and Pinnacle 10+. The quality looks solid on both, but Pinnacle looks slightly sharper. I can't do a test DVD build because I'm at work, but it looks good.
 
I like the edit tools in Pinnacle. They are annoying as hell in UVS10, but that has 5.1 capability. Pinnacle supposedly does too, but I don't think it's true 5.1. I'm on the fence.
 
My version of Pinnacle (9.3) doesn't support 5.1. It's more a very poor Pro Logic. I was really not impressed with it when I used it to mix a scene of a short film I am making. As far as video quality, never really noticed it being that poor. It was more poor sources I had. DVD video imported though S-Video and a video capture card and DV footage from a less-than-steller Panasonic PVGS250.
 
That's what I did as well. I captured through my DVX into Avid. It was easy and quick to edit, but the quality was washed out. It sucks too because audio editing is great w/ Avid. It sucks ass in these consumer editing programs.
 
I bought Adobe Premiere Elements 3.0 today as it was on sale and I had a gift card at my local electronics store. I'm wondering if it'll suite my needs to jumping into the FE pond. I haven't opened it yet hoping someone out there has used it to let me know if it's good or not.
 
I tried do work with Premiere but couldn't figure it out.
 
Oh man... I'm so glad I downloaded a demo before opening the box. I don't meet the minimum system requirements to rut it. Something about SSE 2 Instruction pack. This blows, but blows less because I can get my money back. Guess it's going to bee the freeware route.
 
TeresofBlood said:
Thanks for the tip. How would I use those as a frameserver(I don't even know what a frame server)?
Click to expand...

I tried just about all of the cheap/free ones and ended up using Sony's VEGAS. Not only did it output a nice quality mpeg, but it also does 5.1 ac3 authoring and can be frameserved. I also found it very intuitive and easier to use than Premiere, tho they are basically the same, feature-wise. I'm still using an older version (6.0) and I believe you can download a trial. For me the best part were the audio tools, which made adding in multiple layers to the soundtrack a piece of cake.

Frameserving btw, is essential for editing without crushing your CPU. Basically you use create a "pretend" AVI -- using VFAPI or even AVS or whatever (go to Videohelp.com) -- which is linked to your real file. Then you edit this small file instead of trying to edit a multi-gig file and taxing your editor.

Also, frameserving works great with VirtualDub and TMPGEnc when creating Divx avis or just smaller scale editing.

When you get really savvy you can run filters between the "frameserver" and your editing and make more efficient adjustments to the image/sound.

Once I understood this whole process, which admittedly takes some frustrating trial & error, editing got faster, easier, and the finished product looked much, much better.
 
AVISynth with DGDecode plugin. It's free.

You can also do some work in VirtualDubMod (also free).

Actually avsFilmCutter is a dandly little visual front end to avisynth designed for editing.
ss_02.jpg

http://members.aol.com/avsfilmcutter/filmcutter.html

Again these are all free. You might work a bit harder with them, but there's no denying that they will produce high quality when you are done.
 
I guess I'm a lazy bastard. I've given in. I've spent way too much time thinking about this. I'm just going to buy Ulead Media Studio Pro or Avid Liquid, which is capture/import/edit/audio edit/dvd authoring all in 1. Expensive but it handles MPEGS!!!! Plus I'll be able to use it for other editing projects in the future and it'll work together with my Avid Xpress.

I'm downloading a demo of Media Studio Pro right now. I'm gonna do some quality tests. If I like it we may be in business. If not, I guess it'll be liquid. Either way, it's about time I get some of my redit projects done!
 
I have Pinnacle studio 9.4 moviebox. It's the only editor i've used for about 5 years now. I like how you can download and use free user - created plug-ins. Mine does have a reverse video tool and many others. These can be found free on several sites, most of which can be found on the offical Pinnacle forum. It supports green screen, which is nice. I've never noticed any bad mpeg encoding through Pinnacle personally. However, there is one major thing that i have learned about this program: it's a different beast depending on what brand of computer you are using.

A friend of mine had problems with Pinnacle that i never had (we have the same version) and vice versa. However, i've used this program for so long that i know all of it's occasional erratic behavior. Mine does support 2 different kinds of surround sound. The first option is a generic, but sometimes useful feature that creates "simulated" surround sound. (For example, you can make a mono audio channel come out of all speakers instead of one, but all speakers play the same audio track). The second option is a lot better, where you have an image of a home theater (think of those THX sound tests that are on some DVD's) and you can make any sound, or any music track, come out of any speaker or speakers that you want, from any area by simply moving a speaker around on the screen. Really cool!

This of course just my opinion, but Pinnacle is essentially a great all - in - one editing program (video/sound cutting, fading, dissolving, manual sound blending, text titles, picture - in - picture, widescreen matting and image reframing, DVD authoring). I really think it comes down to how it will behave on your computer. For some it's great, for others it can be a big headache. So unfortunely, it's probably not for everyone (unless perhaps you have the final patch installed). But from the years i've used it and learned it, i love it. For those of you that have Pinnacle, do be sure to download the final patch, which basically makes all versions of Pinnacle (almost) bug - free. So far my programs of choice are Pinnacle studio, TMPgenc DVD author, TMPgenc source creator and Canopus procoder. And for cleaning up sound, Cool edit pro 2.0.

Let me know if you need any links!
 
Okay. Now that I have it down to Ulead Media Studio and Avid Liquid, the biggest thing I need to know is how to retain that quality through export. I have seen that exporting MPEG2 at under 7000 kb creates a lot of artifacting and the quality is sub-par to say the least.

All of you seem to use separate encoding tools, so do you export to AVI at lossless quality? And then encode to MPEG in the encoding program? And I'm sure this is where frameserving comes in, which I still haven't quite figured out, but I have virtual dub and I know that does it. Anyway, if you guys could tell me your process (preferably in Ulead Media Studio) from taking the completed edit and creating the video file you burn to DVD. Thanks.
 
http://www.debugmode.com/frameserver/usage.php

a framserver will do the trick. You serve via avs or virtualdub to CCE (basic edition is 60$) or tmpgenc (freeware).

Tmpgenc takes longer but produces very good qulaity even with bitrates below 5000, depending on the number of passes and the internal settings.
Try the MDVD and KDVD settings for mulitpass.
 
YES!!!!!!! I GET IT NOW!!!! I had no idea that it was possible to do something like this. I've been wondering for years how to do this! This is incredible. I love this framserving business! Thanks for the help guys. I truly appreciate it. Now that I know how to use a frameserver, I'm gonna re-edit FvsJ again(the cuts are so easy it'll only take a couple days) and I'll have it done so I can move on!
 
I was successfully able to use the debugmode frameserver plugin with Ulead VideoStudio 10 and encode to MPEG in Sorenson Squeeze as a test, but when I took the same video clip and used the debugmode frameserver in Media Studio 8, I got an error in Squeeze that it was an unrecognizable format.

For anyone who uses Media Studio pro, how do you framserve to your MPEG encoder?

Also, here is my process from what I've figured out so far.

1) Rip DVD with DVD shrink
2) Use Cinematize to convert VOBs to M2V and AC3 files, preserving the 5.1 audio. Then I used Imago to multiplex it.
3) I tested with both Ulead VS10 and MS8 and I recieved the error I described above with MS, but VS worked, though the MPEG encoder I'm using right now sucks, but I'd like to get the MS frameserver issue fixed first.

***Note: I'm using demos of both MS8 and VS10 right now.
 
1) Don't rip the DVD with DVDS shrink. DVD shrink is no ripper. It messes up the quality. To rip, use DVD Decrpyter or DVD FAB Decrypter or Any DVD.
2)I use PGDDemux for that now and it does a brilliant job. Then I change the ac-3 sound to wave with headac3he, then I multiplex with tmpgxpress, but you can also take tmpg for this. (Using wav isntead of ac3 results inbetter syncing).
3) I use this framserver http://www.videotools.net/index.php?rub ... 6916d086b6
but you have to buy it for 25$. It works just great.
 
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