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Batman Forever is one of those films where every faneditor has had a crack at it in some way, adding back deleted scenes, trimming the campiness and trying to rein in the over the top stuff. Rumours have always swirled that there was an early cut, that the director Joel Schumacher had preferred before WB forced recuts and re-edits (where have I heard this?).
Most notably, Shumacher was asked about the Red Book Edition in an interview, and sounded extremely positive about it.
It always sounded like he wanted a new cut of the film out there, and there was talk of something being released in 2005 for the DVD, but nothing ever came except some deleted scenes.
But a few weeks ago, Kevin Smith said he had gotten ahold of the early director's cut somehow, and said he would review it and detail what was different. He kept to his word and talked about it with a friend of his. I listened to his dicussion and typed up everything that we now know about this cut of the film.
GENERAL THOUGHTS AND INFO
- Smith's friend Joe Black saw a 'special screening' of it and then got the cut afterwards on a USB
- he tried to use the 4k disc to make a higher quality version, did it for a month and got tired
- looks like it was off the AVID in 95, with a burnt in date
- 'Utterly watchable' (likely refering to the quality of the image, not the objective opinion of the material)
- said to be a better cut of the film
- TC was made into a 'toy movie'
- fits more with Schumacher's filmography (Lost Boys, Falling Down, etc.)
- was in post up to a point where it had the Elliot Goldenthal Batman March, but mostly had temp score with Batman '89, Batman Returns and Interview with the Vampire scores, all done by Danny Elfman
- 2hr 35min roughly (TC is 2hr 1min)
- Must've been a pre-test-screen cut
SPECIFICS
- opening is completely reorganised
- first scene is the deleted scene in Arkham, before cutting to the courtroom origin (shown later in the TC on a TV), before cutting back to the cell with the dead guard (deleted scene seen on the DVD without the courtroom part)
- not much more Tommy Lee Jones
- they ADR'ed a lot of Two-Face's lines in the theatrical cut
- meet Edward Nygma and spend time with him, working on the TV box before he meets Bruce
- Jon Favreau was in this as Wayne Industries financial advisor and he has lines, in some kind of scene with Bruce being surrounded with other Wayne Industries people
- Val Kilmer doesn't suit up as Batman until roughly 15 minutes in (TC has him as Batman in the opening scene)
- security guard doesn't have any lines (no 'oh my god its boiling acid')
- the dick grayson karate laundry is not in this cut
- Two-Faces line during Riddler's intro "and who the hell are you" was redubbed to be more over the top
- the glow thugs are all redubbed too
- Bruce has amnesia cause of being shot in the head, has to go into the cave and face his psyche, face the giant bat, and accept he is Batman Forever
- the giant bat sequence is in there
- the red book (father's diary) is important in this one, instead of bruce wanting to go see the movie, now its that thomas wayne wanted to go see the movie
- the third act, robin is useless and is captured twice
- holy rusted metal is in there
- Riddler at the end (in his glittery outfit) is all dubbed too, with louder and bigger dialogue
- Riddler's 'why can't i kill you' is not in this cut
A lot of really interesting info on what the film looked like at an earlier stage, and it seems like it did resemble the script that's been floating around for years.
Kevin Smith has stated he is screening this cut of the film on July 1st and August 25th, at his cinema in New Jersey. Would be great if someone could get out there and report on it, but its only a 200 seat theatre and tickets are sold out. Hopefully someone on the internet goes there and writes up a detailed review of it (or better yet steals the USB with the cut on it).
Most notably, Shumacher was asked about the Red Book Edition in an interview, and sounded extremely positive about it.
"I'm wondering if you've seen something. There is an alternate version of the film, known as Batman Forever: Red Book Edition, where an editor with tremendous skills, nobody knows who, it was done anonymously, took the deleted scenes, and took the film and put it all back together and made a few little edits here and there to try to create the film that you've talked about wanting to have made over the years, something more serious and a little darker. It's a tremendous accomplishment, and even many people who criticized the theatrical release saw this version and loved it. It won the film many new fans, in other words. Have you seen this unofficial fan-edited Red Book Edition?"
Joel Schumacher: No! Can I see it? Is there any way I can thank the editor? You can certainly put a thank you from me, for loving it enough to do that and taking such care!
It always sounded like he wanted a new cut of the film out there, and there was talk of something being released in 2005 for the DVD, but nothing ever came except some deleted scenes.
But a few weeks ago, Kevin Smith said he had gotten ahold of the early director's cut somehow, and said he would review it and detail what was different. He kept to his word and talked about it with a friend of his. I listened to his dicussion and typed up everything that we now know about this cut of the film.
GENERAL THOUGHTS AND INFO
- Smith's friend Joe Black saw a 'special screening' of it and then got the cut afterwards on a USB
- he tried to use the 4k disc to make a higher quality version, did it for a month and got tired
- looks like it was off the AVID in 95, with a burnt in date
- 'Utterly watchable' (likely refering to the quality of the image, not the objective opinion of the material)
- said to be a better cut of the film
- TC was made into a 'toy movie'
- fits more with Schumacher's filmography (Lost Boys, Falling Down, etc.)
- was in post up to a point where it had the Elliot Goldenthal Batman March, but mostly had temp score with Batman '89, Batman Returns and Interview with the Vampire scores, all done by Danny Elfman
- 2hr 35min roughly (TC is 2hr 1min)
- Must've been a pre-test-screen cut
SPECIFICS
- opening is completely reorganised
- first scene is the deleted scene in Arkham, before cutting to the courtroom origin (shown later in the TC on a TV), before cutting back to the cell with the dead guard (deleted scene seen on the DVD without the courtroom part)
- not much more Tommy Lee Jones
- they ADR'ed a lot of Two-Face's lines in the theatrical cut
- meet Edward Nygma and spend time with him, working on the TV box before he meets Bruce
- Jon Favreau was in this as Wayne Industries financial advisor and he has lines, in some kind of scene with Bruce being surrounded with other Wayne Industries people
- Val Kilmer doesn't suit up as Batman until roughly 15 minutes in (TC has him as Batman in the opening scene)
- security guard doesn't have any lines (no 'oh my god its boiling acid')
- the dick grayson karate laundry is not in this cut
- Two-Faces line during Riddler's intro "and who the hell are you" was redubbed to be more over the top
- the glow thugs are all redubbed too
- Bruce has amnesia cause of being shot in the head, has to go into the cave and face his psyche, face the giant bat, and accept he is Batman Forever
- the giant bat sequence is in there
- the red book (father's diary) is important in this one, instead of bruce wanting to go see the movie, now its that thomas wayne wanted to go see the movie
- the third act, robin is useless and is captured twice
- holy rusted metal is in there
- Riddler at the end (in his glittery outfit) is all dubbed too, with louder and bigger dialogue
- Riddler's 'why can't i kill you' is not in this cut
A lot of really interesting info on what the film looked like at an earlier stage, and it seems like it did resemble the script that's been floating around for years.
Kevin Smith has stated he is screening this cut of the film on July 1st and August 25th, at his cinema in New Jersey. Would be great if someone could get out there and report on it, but its only a 200 seat theatre and tickets are sold out. Hopefully someone on the internet goes there and writes up a detailed review of it (or better yet steals the USB with the cut on it).