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Death to Han Solo!

Should Lucas have allowed Han Solo to die in Return of the Jedi?

  • Yes, sacrificing Han would have been a more dramatic, satisfying conclusion to his character.

    Votes: 23 63.9%

  • No, killing his character off would have been far too dark.

    Votes: 13 36.1%
  • Total voters
    36
  • Poll votes is visible for users with special permission.
L8wrtr said:
But Empire clearly sets up that he is not completely on board with the Alliance, and he only fully commits to the Alliance in Jedi AFTER Jabba is dead, which was one of the forces driving his self-serving agenda, protect himself first. That he commits himself to the Rebellion after the threat to himself has been eliminated isn't a major leap in his character, it's a safe leap.
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Again, while I certainly agree that Han could have been handled better in ROTJ, I can't agree with you on this. With Jabba dead, and Han still in possession of most of his prize money (I know the official time between ANH and ESB is three years, but I don't put it anywhere over six months), he had the whole universe to go gallivanting in. He chose to join the likely suicidal Endor mission for the sake of his friends, the cause, revenge, and Leia.
 
Gaith said:
(I know the official time between ANH and ESB is three years, but I don't put it anywhere over six months),
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More importantly, how long was it between ESB and ROTJ in which Luke is trained to become a full Jedi? Whatever the length of time, Luke must be the most gifted Jedi who ever lived.
 
Yoda didn't mean that remark... it was confidence-building happy talk... I've got no other explanation for it... :p

But someday, I'll do a Jedi edit, and that line will definitely go if possible. :)
 
I have no problem with Luke's 'graduation' in Jedi. His experience on Bespin WAS the lesson that he needed. I always took Jedi training to have two parts, the physical, and the mental. Once begun, the physical training is one of focus and determination. Once you have the keys on how to practice/focus, at some point, guidance from a mentor isn't required, you can simply continue the conditioning on your own. Like running, if you've never run, you need someone to teach you how to practice running, but at some point you just keep doing it yourself, improving on your own through repetition and experience.

The more important part of Jedi training I always figured was the mental aspect. Yoda had taught Luke how to commune or access the Force, how to manipulate it, and how to let it flow through him. Again at some point that type of training only gets the learner so far and in the end, what is important, what the final lesson is needed is how to control one's self in relation to the Force. Luke was still impulsive when he left Dagobah. His confrontation with Vader ended up being the final humbling lesson that Luke needed to understand the nature and power of the Force. His lesson was one of perspective. From that point on, further development of his 'skills' was something only he could really affect the progress of. He gained the ultimate understanding of the Force from which he could continue to evolve as a Jedi.

That he had to face Vader one last time in order to earn the title Jedi simply seemed like the final Test, or proof if you will. To me this seemed akin to learning all the detailed problem solving skills let's say in physics, you're given one last massive problem which requires you creatively apply all your knowledge/skills. This is later described as 'the trials' in the PT, and probably best explained in the original Clone Wars cell animation cartoon.

My only problem with Luke's training was that took him 6 months to go back to Yoda, which is something that Spence creatively addressed in his edit of Jedi.
 
L8wrtr said:
That he had to face Vader one last time in order to earn the title Jedi simply seemed like the final Test, or proof if you will. To me this seemed akin to learning all the detailed problem solving skills let's say in physics, you're given one last massive problem which requires you creatively apply all your knowledge/skills. This is later described as 'the trials' in the PT, and probably best explained in the original Clone Wars cell animation cartoon.
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Maybe I'm forgetting something, but I thought in the cartoon they just cut off his braid because they were short on Jedi or something.
 
TV's Frink said:
Maybe I'm forgetting something, but I thought in the cartoon they just cut off his braid because they were short on Jedi or something.
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Somehow I missed your post. It's been a while since I watched 'season' 1 of the cell animation. This was actually the Anakin story arc where Anakin and Obi-Wan end up on a planet where there are only women creatures and young boys. The adult males have all been captured by the Separatists and used in some nasty mind-control/physical mutation experiment. He has some type of vision (which presents him images of Vader) and he is revealed to be the hero destined to free the inhabitants. That experience ends up being his equivalent of 'The Trials'
 
I remember that, but I think he was a Jedi Knight at that point.
 
I think they had said something along the lines that because of the needs of the war, they would forgo his normal 'trial' and that events of the war would present him his own trial, and then the cartoon (iirc) implied that this was his trial, without directly saying it. Or, I could be full of it. ;)
 
THIS THREAD IS NOW ABOUT HOW ANAKIN BECAME A JEDI

:p
 
Frink, hows this for a thought, without selfless Han sacrificing himself at the end of ROTJ and completing his character's arc, Lucas decided that in later versions Han didn't need to be quite so selfless = Resulting in Greedo shooting first :D
 
I believe Han shoudl have died and we shuld have had the "Luke walking off into the sunset" sending Kurtz mentioned. It woudl IMO be more dramatic. Han coudl have even died when LAndo was checking the carbonite slab at the end of Empire and when Vader says "Well is he still alive", he could have said "no".

True there would be no great scene on teh sail barge but maybe could have been "Revenge of the Jedi" on Jabba and the Emperor.

I plan to do an edit of the orginal trilogy eventually as one film where Han dies in Empire, hope it comes off ok. Right now I am doing an all in one prequel edit which I hope to post here.
 
Killing Solo seems like quite an interesting challenge... :)
One I'm willing to accept in due time even.
 
I think a bigger challenge is the correct spellings of could and would. Bondukkevin :p
 
I can't imagine them killing off Han Solo, he was the reason I purchased all the book sequels ad nauseum, and enjoyed every one.

If Lando had a heroic death that would have ramped up the drama, but not Han....no never Han....

:behindsofa:
 
I like the idea of Leia defrosting him wrong at the start of ROTJ, and cooking him to death. Could have played a little like the moment Angel is restored, kisses Buffy, then is skewered.

Sort of.
 
Great question and super discussion!

I can't really choose. When I first saw RotJ at age 8, I was devastated that the one Ewok was killed. As much as I loved the movie, I thought that Lucas and his compatriots must have been sadists for killing off that cute, friendly (nameless) little teddy bear!

As an adult, it's rather astonishing to me that an intergalactic war could have the death of one Ewok as its main casualty. I think that someone should have died, although I'm not sure if Han was the right choice. (I don't have any other suggestions, either, though.)

I do think that Luke should have fallen to the dark side of the Force completely, but possibly temporarily. Maybe Luke should have been the one to have a heroic sacrificial death, after he was turned back.

Besides, if Han dies, then that leaves the path open to a Luke-and-Leia romance, a concept which will forever be "ewwww" in my mind. :)

While Lucas may have had the wrong motivation for giving RotJ a happy ending, I think the movies play better that way. I wouldn't want a bittersweet ending where the Rebellion is in shambles.

The happy-dark-happy ending structure makes the trilogy feel like the movements in a piece of music (as Lucas has often described it himself). The prequels, by their nature, couldn't do that. III was always destined to have the darkest ending, which means it goes happy-happy-dark. It just doesn't feel right.

Star Wars is by its nature a fairy tale, and fairy tales should end with "happily ever after."

I can still distinctly remember standing in the theater as the RotJ credits played, and not wanting to leave because of the euphoric feeling I had from the way the movie ended. I wouldn't want to do anything that would take that away from my 8-year-old self.

When I talk to kids and to casual fans, many of them say that RotJ is their favorite. I think that many of them respond to the unambigiously happy ending as well.

So . . . someone major should have died, possibly Luke, but the films should still have had an overall happy ending, IMHO.

Does that answer your question? :)
 
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