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4K releases need to stop scrubbing grain

DonkeyKonga

DonkeyKonga

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See title. Does anyone actually know anyone who enjoys these wax figure looking old films? Ugh. I'm tired of purchasing in excitement for improved HDR colors and having to ask a refund because they scrubbed away detail.
 
DonkeyKonga said:
See title. Does anyone actually know anyone who enjoys these wax figure looking old films? Ugh. I'm tired of purchasing in excitement for improved HDR colors and having to ask a refund because they scrubbed away detail.
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You've gotten a refund on movie purchases after viewing them?
 
DigModiFicaTion said:
You've gotten a refund on movie purchases after viewing them?
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Sure. Physical releases that is. I'll just tell them it's not what its advertised to be. I also dont finish these films because well why would I finish a film that looks like shit lol.

I did this with lotr, once upon a time in the west (although to be fair that one looks ok, but it kinda of looks like a modern digital movie now which is just completely weird with the still ancient sounding audio) and terminator 2. It's insane that my old dvd (dvd, not even bluray) looks better than 4k.

Ironically the releases I want to have most of all look worst. Except for Indy, that one actually knocked it out of the park.

I feel like theres two possible reasons: they think casuals like it, or they know people wont upgrade the inevitable 8k releases if they dont purposefully botch it up (which is true tbh there is 0 reason for 8k movies lol)

The fact that you can return physical releases is one of the primary reasons I very much prefer to buy physical if I'm not 100% sure about the quality.
 
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LOTR looks painfully bad on UHD, but you've returned it? So how were you able to do that re-graining thing on it? (is the project alive btw?)

I'v kept that terrible, so called "remaster" of T2 on blu just because I wanted to try some re-graining on it, and eventually sticked to another fan-restoration based on it.

I'm not buying 4K UHD but before I buy any older movie on blu, I usually check reviews and Caps-a-holic comparisons so there was no single case when I wanted to return a movie because I know what I am buying in the first place.
 
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Gieferg said:
LOTR looks painfully bad on UHD, but you've returned it? So how were you able to do that re-graining thing on it? (is the project alive btw?)

I'v kept that terrible, so called "remaster" of T2 on blu just because I wanted to try some re-graining on it, and eventually sticked to another fan-restoration based on it.

I'm not buying 4K UHD but before I buy any older movie on blu, I usually check reviews and Caps-a-holic comparisons so there was no single case when I wanted to return a movie because I know what I am buying in the first place.
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Project is dead for that reason in fact. I ripped it after purchase to see if it could be salvaged (and before turning it back). But it just couldnt be done so I gave up and deleted all files etc. Obviously if I ever would have released it I would have purchased the film again.

Recently a HDR scan of the theatrical cut was done by a fan which made my attempt redundant on top of that. It looks pretty good, a bit too contrasty but nothing messing around with the tv settings wont fix.

I might re-create my extended cut with the bluray version for narrative purposes if theres interest in a more streamlined extended RotK, but the bluray definitely beats the 4k for me personally so I wont be wasting money on it in the future.

Funny how you also tried to regrain T2. To no avail I suppose?

I 100% agree with your review approach. The good the bad and the ugly is an amazing 4k release btw! Easy purchase if you're into the film. No HDR but it does have a terrific color grade! Must buy really.

Once upon a time in the west honestly is great in 4k and was the most respectful DNR I've seen yet. If lotr looked like this I dont think I would have even minded. It's just that there is such a huge audio/video disconnect now because it's such a very old film that now looks kind of modern with dated audio so it's just a weird viewing experience now. BUT I think any post-90s film with this delicate level of DNR and more modern audio could actually work.
 
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The problem with T2's 4K release is that it's literally just the 3D re-release but in 2D, complete with all the scrubbing and teal-and-orange... -ing, that gets done to these 3D re-releases of old movies. Just look at Jurassic Park 3D. Imagining if we were stuck with that instead of the official 4K version we got makes me shudder.
 
Tee Jay said:
The problem with T2's 4K release is that it's literally just the 3D re-release but in 2D, complete with all the scrubbing and teal-and-orange... -ing, that gets done to these 3D re-releases of old movies. Just look at Jurassic Park 3D. Imagining if we were stuck with that instead of the official 4K version we got makes me shudder.
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I really recommend finding that Lotr theatrical HDR scan. Particularly RotK is phenomenal. 60/70 GB per file but worth it for the experience.

Fellowship and TT have a little black crush and fellowship has a bit more damage to the real than ideal, but apart from that the colorgrade is just like you remember them from the cinemas.

I imagine these on a beamer would be out of this world.

Its extra frustrating once you realise what a person who bought a reel on ebay was able to pull off. Really makes these official releases all the more embarrassing.
 
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DonkeyKonga said:
Funny how you also tried to regrain T2. To no avail I suppose?
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Well, not exactly. But I had some encoding problems, and sanjuro_61 has done it better.
I am very happy with his version so I've just abandoned my project (but later regrained Star Trek TMP Director's Edition).

Project is dead
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Shame, some of your screenshots looked gorgeous.
 
Gieferg said:
Well, not exactly. But I had some encoding problems, and sanjuro_61 has done it better.
I am very happy with his version so I've just abandoned my project (but later regrained Star Trek TMP Director's Edition).
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Are there any before after comparisons of this version? It's a 4k with added grain I take it?
 
Version of what?
I am not doing anything in 4K, and Sanjuro's T2 was also 1080p only.
 
Ah I misunderstood I thought you meant someone pulled a 4k off. 😁
 
DigModiFicaTion said:
You've gotten a refund on movie purchases after viewing them?
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I’ve gotten refunds from digital releases as well. It’s pretty easy to accidentally purchase a digital movie, or one of my kids purchase one without my permission. It’s just the click of a button. When that happens it’s very easy to return for a refund. This is through Apple, not sure about other companies.
 
Bailey said:
I’ve gotten refunds from digital releases as well. It’s pretty easy to accidentally purchase a digital movie, or one of my kids purchase one without my permission. It’s just the click of a button. When that happens it’s very easy to return for a refund. This is through Apple, not sure about other companies.
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that's why I never buy digital from Playstation store. Those are some miserable bastards.

My little brother one day took my moms phone and bought for like 250 euros of stuff using her authenticator (my mom uses the same pin for everything) and we couldn't get a refund because it 'had been used'. Were talking used for a day here. Were talking about skins not even actual games or anything. It's just a bit of code.

Not to mention the insane logic: if you play it once you cant get a refund. Then how am I supposed to know I even get my money's worth? It's not like I always agree with reviews lol.
 
Tee Jay said:
The problem with T2's 4K release is that it's literally just the 3D re-release but in 2D, complete with all the scrubbing and teal-and-orange... -ing, that gets done to these 3D re-releases of old movies. Just look at Jurassic Park 3D. Imagining if we were stuck with that instead of the official 4K version we got makes me shudder.
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I mean yeah, no duh? That T2 restoration was done for the 3D re-release, and also released on Blu-Ray, 4K at the same time. I mean what else were they going to put on the 4k disc, a whole different resoration?
If the Jurassic Park 3D re-release also happened at the advent of 4k discs, I bet we would of been stuck with that master in 4k too.
 
In a 3D rerelease, more steps are done to the image after the actual stereoscopic conversion, in order to make the final image work better in 3d. Unfortunately, T2 4K is stuck with those extra steps, even though it's a 2D version. After the initial scanning and cleaning of the negative (assuming that's how the 3D/4K restoration started), they should have branched/forked the restoration team into a separate 3D and 2D version.
 
DonkeyKonga said:
I really recommend finding that Lotr theatrical HDR scan. Particularly RotK is phenomenal. 60/70 GB per file but worth it for the experience.

Fellowship and TT have a little black crush and fellowship has a bit more damage to the real than ideal, but apart from that the colorgrade is just like you remember them from the cinemas.

I imagine these on a beamer would be out of this world.

Its extra frustrating once you realise what a person who bought a reel on ebay was able to pull off. Really makes these official releases all the more embarrassing.
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Have you seen the Dremastered edtions by DrDre at the Original Trilogy forums? They're sourced from the Blu-rays, with the theatrical color grade and a careful AI upscaling to 4K that preserves all details (including grain). He finished all three of the theatrical editions already and has finished part 1 of the extended edition of "The Fellowship of the Ring".
 
hbenthow said:
Have you seen the Dremastered edtions by DrDre at the Original Trilogy forums? They're sourced from the Blu-rays, with the theatrical color grade and a careful AI upscaling to 4K that preserves all details (including grain). He finished all three of the theatrical editions already and has finished part 1 of the extended edition of "The Fellowship of the Ring".
Click to expand...

Oh I'm all on that. I will be waiting on the extended cuts and probably edit those narratively if it ever comes to it.

The theatricals looked amazing but if I'm watching the theatrical I slightly prefer the look of those recent 4k HDR scans.
 
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