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The ARROWVERSE (Flash, Arrow, Supergirl, Legends,etc)

bionicbob

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CRISIS EXPECTATIONS & PREDICTIONS...

Executive Producer Marc Guggenheim has said this crossover is an HOMAGE, not an adaptation, to the original classic comic.

Therefore I suspect it will share the same themes but the not the same story. Also, in the 30 plus years since the CRISIS comic, the production team has the advantage of hindsight, knowing what worked and what did not work.

So I predict it will have the same basic plot structure...
--the Multiverse under attack by the Anti-Monitor and his Shadow Demons
--a team of heroes from across Time, Space and Universes assembled to confront the threat
--lots of Earths destroyed, with hero cameos from older shows and deaths
--some Time Travel, the building of Anti-Matter Towers
--I am betting Hour Three will end on a dramatic cliffhanger with the entire Multiverse apparently wiped out, with the screen going completely white.... as it will be 4 weeks before the crossover is concluded in mid-January.
--but will the producers merge the Multiverse into a Single Earth? I very much doubt it. Or I should clarify, I could see them doing it for ONE Episode of the crossover, but I strongly suspect there will be a Cosmic Reset Button at the end, and the various shows will return to respective universes.
--however, with that said, Guggenheim has said there will be lasting status quo changes for every show post-Crisis and the individual Showrunners have a free ticket to use the event to make any changes to their shows they want. To it will be interesting to see how that plays out.

What else do we know about the crossover?

Guggenheim said a couple of days ago there are still 6 unannounced guests in the the first three hours (from the trailer that dropped the other day, I assume Will Wheaton is one; doing an homage to Superman II) and more in the last two. Who else may be showing up?

There is a rumour The Spectre is in the crossover. If true, will we get the iconic DC Comics scene of the Birth of the Universe?
And if so, could we get a cameo of the Green Lanterns or Guardians of the Universe, since HBOMAX will be launching a Green Lantern series also produced by Arrowverse master Greg Berlanti?

So much speculation and excitement.. lol.
Reminds me of the "Old Days" of Network TV and Event Television Mini-Series... Roots, Winds of War, North and South...

Only a few more hours.... 
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Nic

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So, how about that Hour One, huh?

Without too much spoilers, this was nice if a little rushed to bring everything and everyone up to speed. I have to say that Crisis on Earth-X is still my favorite of these crossovers. Yeah, we still have 4 hours of CoIE to go, but Earth X's first hour was allowed to take time to let the story breath and give a lot of character interactions from pairings you wouldn't expect, like Alex Danvers and Sara Lance. But, like I said, 4 more hours to go, so we might get those character moments yet.

And to be honest, we did get a really great moment, between Sara and Earth-16 Oliver and Clark and Kara, but this first hour still suffers from trying to get into the action from minute 1.

Also, Oliver 'aint dead, at least not yet. Forget the fact that there are still three episodes of Arrow left, one of which is a Crisis episode, you really expect him to permanently die off outside his own show?
 

Jrzag42

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I still have 10 minutes left that I need to finish later, but so far I'm really enjoying this, more than the previous crossover.

I don't actively watch these shows, but I'm able to follow this just fine despite that.
 

bionicbob

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Just a few brief SPOILER-FREE observations until I get to rewatch Hour One again....

Hour One felt a bit more rushed compared to the equally massive EARTH-X Crossover , and the Arrowverse Trinity did not get true moment together.  In fact, Barry felt very absent for most of the episode.  Honestly, it almost felt like there was a deleted scene or two to me, as some key moments seem to happen Off Screen.   Or perhaps there will be some non-linear story telling in this crossover to fill in some of the gaps.  For unlike Earth-X, which treated all four episodes as one single movie, this time it feels like each Name Show Character is central while the others are guest stars.

But these are minor nitpicks at this point.  I was pretty much grinning from beginning to end.

As this was the SUPERGIRL episode, there was some nice call backs to past storylines and our two Kryptonian cousins had some solid moments.     I loved the Rocket Pod scene and the Marlon Brando lines of dialogue!

Loved the brief cameos.

The musical score work was epically excellent.

I do need to go back and re-watch the season one LEGENDS episode "Star City 2046" to see how it connects and the true purpose for the scene, as I doubt it was a simple continuity correction.

And while I was shocked that a certain hero died in Hour One, I do not believe for a moment he is really gone.

Overall, a very epic, fast paced, tense hour!  Good comic booky stuff!!!
 

bionicbob

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After re-watching Legends "Star City 2046", I am more confused lol

The Star City 2046 visited in CRISIS is not the same one from LEGENDS.  Sara's line of dialogue made it sound like it was to me.

The Legends' Star City is an alternate possible future based on Sara and Ray never returning to Star City from their Legends mission.

The Crisis Star City is a world where Sara died on the Gambit.

In both, it appears Oliver lost an arm.

Was anyone else confused by this?
 

Zarius

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I haven't seen hours one and two in their entirety, just clips from Youtube, I don't think I can sit through any of the CW shows any longer, I just don't have the attention span.

But here's what I thought of two very super-riffic scenes

Seems all four Superman movies are canon again according to Brandon's version, plus Superman Returns. He makes a mention of fighting himself during Superman III. He reveals he married Lois but she and the whole DP staff were killed by The Joker (Joker isn't mentioned, but you know he's talking about him). Most strange. Clash with CW Superman was a bit ropey, the consequences of doing something as big in scale as this on a TV budget, but overall could have been worse.

Smallville's Tom Welling four minutes on screen was great, even if he did do very minimal other than look imposing and a little disconnected and looking well past everything going on around him now. No explanation as to how he lost his powers either. I'm a bit confused that Lex would not make the connection between Clark and Superman on his Earth, but could believe Clark was Superman on other worlds
 

bionicbob

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Zarius said:
I haven't seen hours one and two in their entirety, just clips from Youtube, I don't think I can sit through any of the CW shows any longer, I just don't have the attention span.

But here's what I thought of two very super-riffic scenes

Seems all four Superman movies are canon again according to Brandon's version, plus Superman Returns. He makes a mention of fighting himself during Superman III. He reveals he married Lois but she and the whole DP staff were killed by The Joker (Joker isn't mentioned, but you know he's talking about him). Most strange. Clash with CW Superman was a bit ropey, the consequences of doing something as big in scale as this on a TV budget, but overall could have been worse.

Smallville's Tom Welling four minutes on screen was great, even if he did do very minimal other than look imposing and a little disconnected and looking well past everything going on around him now. No explanation as to how he lost his powers either. I'm a bit confused that Lex would not make the connection between Clark and Superman on his Earth, but could believe Clark was Superman on other worlds

Sorry... can not get the SPOILER tag to work... 

Executive Producer/writer Guggenheim stated that Routh's Superman is a continuation of his Big Screen character, and thus, a continuation of Chris Reeve's Superman.  So we got music cues from the Donner movie, reference to Superman III Junkyard Fight and Superman mentions his son Jason.  

Tom Welling's scene was nice and in character for the most part.  Though if I was a family man (and I am) and I used to be my planet's protector, and learned the Multiverse was in danger, would I just walk away? hhmmmm....  Still holding out unrealistic hope that Welling returns in a suit for Hour Five LOL...   though Guggenheim said there is a scene with THREE Supermans in it at once.  
As for the powers, I assume he gave them up with some sort of Kryptonian crystal like he has in the past in the movies and tv show.

During John Byrne's revamp of Superman, very early on, Lex's computer provides undisputable evidence that Clark is Superman.  It is obvious.  But Lex does not believe the evidence.  He is so arrogant, that it is inconceivable that anyone with so much power would every pretend to be ordinary.  This meeting between Cryer and Welling is a great homage to that classic comic moment.   I LOVED this scene.  It perfectly captured Lex's arrogance and madness.  He does not want to kill boring Clark.  He wants to kill a God.   Seeing Welling depowered and so happy being human, ruined the murderous fun he was having.  Pitch Perfect Lex.
 

bionicbob

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CRISIS PART TWO...

If Hour One was packed with plot set-up and comic book style action, Hour Two was filled with the wonderful character beats we have come to expect from the Arrowverse.

--EARTH-99... a future Gotham City that is an amalgam of Kingdom Come and Frank Miller's Dark Knight.  When Kevin Conroy came down those stairs doing the classic Batman voice, I got the chills.  A great, disturbing cautionary tale.

--EARTH-167... Tom Welling's brief return.  Some fans with love, some will hate.  If it is his last appearance of his version of Clark Kent, then it is nice to know the character got the happy ending he always wanted.

--EARTH-96... Brandon Routh's return as SUPERMAN!!!!!!!  Perfect.  Absolutely perfect.

--meanwhile, the aftermath of a certain hero's death continues to play out with disturbing consequences.

Absolutely fantastic second hour!
 

Jrzag42

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According to Wikipedia, last night's episode of Black Lightning also ties in to the crossover. Has anyone watched it? Is it important?
 

bionicbob

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jrWHAG42 said:
According to Wikipedia, last night's episode of Black Lightning also ties in to the crossover. Has anyone watched it? Is it important?

I watched.  It establishes the parallel world/multiverse concept to BL.  The Red Skies are present throughout the story. The core story is about Jen seeing two alternate Earths where she made two very different choices about the use of her powers.  It is only the last 30 seconds where the Anti-matter wave hits their Earth and Black Lightning vanishes in a white light.
 

Jrzag42

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Thank you, you saved me an hour. It doesn't seem like I'd be missing anything by skipping it.

Anyways, I just finished Part 2, and I loved it. Very much looking forward to the next part.
I really hope that someone makes a movie edit once the whole thing is finished (and once it's available to purchase of course), I think I'd enjoy it more in one big thing rather than smaller chunks, and I think some scenes could be reordered.

It's worth noting, while watching the first part, I couldn't help but draw comparisons to Fantastic Four Rise of the Silver Surfer, with a being go around destroying worlds, another being warning the heroes of it, and the heroes fighting to prevent it, although I'm sure a lot of stories fit that description. It didn't help that while watching on the CW app, I kept getting ads for some show called Forever starring Ioan Gruffudd.
 

bionicbob

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Well they have been up front and putting out there at the beginning of every ARROW season 8 episode this year, and now it all makes sense....

"My name is Oliver Queen. For seven years, I have fought with only one goal--to save my city. But now a new threat has emerged. A danger so severe it has forced me to leave my family in order to face it, and it won't be enough for me to just be the Green Arrow. To prevent the crisis that's coming, I am going to have to become someone else. I am going to have to become something else."

Good thing Ollie already has the green hood. lol
 

bionicbob

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CRISIS PART THREE...

--Not one, but TWO Birds of Prey!
--Earth--666, they publicly denied it for months, but we got a Devilish cameo!
--Black Lightning formally joins the Arrowverse, has a significant role to play and a great conversation with Barry towards the end.
--FLASH-90!!!!  The Anti-Matter Cannon! So much comic book goodness!
--introduction of Ryan Choi, future new Atom... instantly likeable.
--introduction of The Spectre... honestly, very under whelming and certainly confusing as there was no set up for it in the previous two episodes and if you are not familiar with the comic, you would scratching your head.
--loved the cliffhanger ending!  Nice tie back to Legends continuity and Lex is just so deliciously devious -- good stuff!

--But it is not a perfect hour of crossover tv, as we have now completed Hour THREE, and the Big Villain, THE ANTI-MONITOR is utterly under developed and unseen, which imo weakens the drive of the narrative quite a bit.  And by extension, it undermines both The Pariah and Harbinger storylines.  Too much is happening off screen and later being shared through awkward exposition.  Hopefully the final 2 hours will resolve this.... 

--FOUR WEEKS til the conclusion!!!
 

Duragizer

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bionicbob said:
But it is not a perfect hour of crossover tv, as we have now completed Hour THREE, and the Big Villain, THE ANTI-MONITOR is utterly under developed

They're being faithful to the source material, then.
 

MusicEd921

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bionicbob said:
Zarius said:
though Guggenheim said there is a scene with THREE Supermans in it at once.  

Tyler, Brandon and.....Dean?

or.....

OMG I would die of happiness.....

Tim Daly????
 

bionicbob

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Duragizer said:
bionicbob said:
But it is not a perfect hour of crossover tv, as we have now completed Hour THREE, and the Big Villain, THE ANTI-MONITOR is utterly under developed

They're being faithful to the source material, then.

Not sure if you are trying to be funny?
Regardless, I disagree.
 

bionicbob

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musiced921 said:
bionicbob said:
Zarius said:
though Guggenheim said there is a scene with THREE Supermans in it at once.  

Tyler, Brandon and.....Dean?

or.....

OMG I would die of happiness.....

Tim Daly????

That would be cool!

Unless he was talking about the Waverider scene with both Ray and KC Superman and Superman-38?

There is a very funny picture (that I can not find for some reason) of Routh, Welling and Hoechlin together (with Guggenheim?) each holding Superman trunks.
 

bionicbob

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A tribute to Routh's Superman... (spoilers)
 

Duragizer

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bionicbob said:
Duragizer said:
bionicbob said:
But it is not a perfect hour of crossover tv, as we have now completed Hour THREE, and the Big Villain, THE ANTI-MONITOR is utterly under developed

They're being faithful to the source material, then.

Not sure if you are trying to be funny?
Regardless, I disagree.

Anti-Monitor from the comics in a nutshell:

"Matter is bad, antimatter is good. I will destroy all matter universes, which are bad, leaving only the Antimatter Universe, which is good."

The guy has no deeper motivation than that.
 
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