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Star Wars VIII - The Last Jedi

Moe_Syzlak

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@"Gaith", once again I agree. My issues are not the ones that are usually highlighted by the media when discussing the polarized views of the movie. I think it is a very vocal minority that is polarized at all, frankly. It seems there are very few  who say they absolutely loved it and very few who absolutely hated it. I know I liked it better than 7, but not by much.
 

Fettclone1

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I think that what's funny overall (and this too is a thing generally in fandom), is the push-back and attempts to discredit people with an opposing opinion.

I include myself in this. I actually had a heated debate with a friend of mine until we just agreed to disagree. 

It's silliness.

I can't understand it personally, but if you truly enjoyed TLJ, then hey, good on you.
 

Zamros

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The irritating thing about fandoms is their ability to take criticism of their favourite thing as a personal insult.
 

TV's Frink

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If you guys are talking about me, you're confusing someone who's insulted with someone who's heard it all by now and just doesn't care.
 

TV's Frink

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Gaith said:
Your trolling abilities continue to grow, your Highness.

Go look up the definition of trolling and then tell me you honestly thinking I'm doing it.
 

TomH1138

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The Scribbling Man said:
As much as I enjoyed the movie, I think that sums it up pretty well. I definitely have no idea where they can take it. It possibly sets things up for a new trilogy, but certainly not a climax. 

Abrams' TFA spent a lot of time setting things up (Snoke, Rey's parentage, Hux, Phasma) that Johnson's TLJ quickly undid. With Abrams in charge of Ep. IX, maybe he'll restore a whole bunch of those same things:
(i.e. "Phasma really isn't dead after all! Kylo lied about Rey's parentage!")

You think maybe these folks could have gotten together and agreed on one clear path for the story, instead of using each movie to shift gears from the other's direction.  :D 

But maybe that won't happen. That's mainly just me being cheeky.  :p
 

TV's Frink

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I don't think you can embed anything other than YouTube or Vimeo links here.
 

Gaith

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Just read an interesting point on another board. If Rey is indeed a "nobody", ancestrally speaking (which in of itself doesn't bother me), than perhaps it's just a pretty wild coincidence that Old Man Max Von Sydow, who seemed to know Leia personally and held a vital clue to Luke's whereabouts, just happened to have retired only a few miles away from her shack? (Not to mention the Falcon also being in the same immediate area.)
 

TM2YC

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TomH1138 said:
Abrams' TFA spent a lot of time setting things up (Rey's parentage) that Johnson's TLJ quickly undid.

Again, I don't remember TFA setting that up.
 

The Scribbling Man

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TM2YC said:
TomH1138 said:
Abrams' TFA spent a lot of time setting things up (Rey's parentage) that Johnson's TLJ quickly undid.

Again, I don't remember TFA setting that up.

It teases the viewers through subtleties here and there - the most obvious being during Rey's force vision. Saying that it "spent a lot of time setting things up" is a bit of a reach though.
 

ThrowgnCpr

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The Scribbling Man said:
Rey's force vision.

I'd call that viewer interpretation, not at all setup by the filmmakers. I think fans were reading way to much into any "hints" in TFA.
 

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Gaith said:
Just read an interesting point on another board. If Rey is indeed a "nobody", ancestrally speaking (which in of itself doesn't bother me), than perhaps it's just a pretty wild coincidence that Old Man Max Von Sydow, who seemed to know Leia personally and held a vital clue to Luke's whereabouts, just happened to have retired only a few miles away from her shack? (Not to mention the Falcon also being in the same immediate area.)

A few miles?
 

ThrowgnCpr

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DigModiFicaTion said:
Apparently Johnson says Rey's parents is still up for grabs: https://screenrant.com/star-wars-last-jedi-rey-parents-kylo-ren-truth/

I assumed it was always up for grabs. Although I am fine with Rey being "from nowhere," which I think fits the theme of TLJ, I always thought it was possible that Kylo was manipulating Rey. At the end of the day, does it really matter where she is from?

No.
 

Fettclone1

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If you mean that the theme of TLJ is "Nothing matters anyway", then I agree.

Also, I don't see how it's much of a stretch to assume that a vision in a movie, as part of a series which deals with the Force, is indeed...wait for it...a Force vision.

I understand some of you like TLJ. Great. But you're kidding yourselves by pretending that there's any sort of coherent narrative between TFA and TLJ. Johnson wrote his story before TFA was completed and he did whatever tf he wanted to do. The end.
 

The Scribbling Man

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It's poor writing to tackle each episode of the trilogy separately without having an idea of the overall direction of the story, and even more so to let each director of each film have free reign over the script, without a clear idea of where things are going. The whole trilogy is being played by ear, and the story will probably suffer because of it.
 

ThrowgnCpr

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Fettclone1 said:
If you mean that the theme of TLJ is "Nothing matters anyway", then I agree.

Based on what we were discussing, you seem to be equating "Nothing matters anyway " with "the galaxy isn't a small incestuous population where every Force-strong person was begat from a Skywalker."


Fettclone1 said:
Also, I don't see how it's much of a stretch to assume that a vision in a movie, as part of a series which deals with the Force, is indeed...wait for it...a Force vision.

Who said it wasn't a Force vision? I don't see a single post claiming that. What people were arguing was that it wasn't some secret clue about her parentage. Do all Force visions tell the viewer who their parents are? Brb, calling Maury...


Fettclone1 said:

Well, then. I guess that's that. Thanks for your amazing insight. I'm totally convinced the movie sucks now.

...

With these great insights, I now propose an alternative storyline for a Star Wars movie that ties ALL THE THINGS together. Based on your username, Fettclone1, I'm guessing this will be a home run with you:

STAR WARS Episode VIII (alt): A NEWER HOPE. With the Porg population at critically low levels, the Jedi Council intervenes to start a captive-breeding program*. Much to their despair, the Jedi are unable to successfully hatch Porgs in captivity. The cliff-dwelling creatures have evolved to nest in extremely wet and windy environments, and without help from a powerful Force-sensitive Jedi Master, the program fails (only a Skywalker is strong enough for this task). In the eleventh hour, legendary Jedi Obi-Wan Kenobi visits the Resistance crew in the form of a Force ghost. Here he instructs the heroic rebels resisters to take a small number of the remaining Porgs to the planet Kamino for cloning and rearing to adulthood. Did you know that Kamino is in the same system as Ach-Too? 'cause it is! They're sister planets with identical atmospheres and surface conditions! See, we only saw Kamino that one time when Obi-Wan went to check on something about cloning warriors. I dunno all the deets, it was something he heard from his buddy Duke Dooku. Aaaannnyyyyway, turns out, that one trip was during the rainy season of a particularly rainy year. Yeah, they always get a lot of rain (which will be important for our current story), but the Kaminoans were dealing with a lot of extra intense weather from an exceptionally strong El Niño year. Long story short, Kamino's weather conditions are really really similar to those on Ach-Too, and perfect for raising Porgs! I guess I should have put this in another footnote. Oh well, moving on...

Because the Kaminoans perfected their cloning facility during the early days of the ...wait for it... CLONE WARS!, the Porg cloning was a great success. Additionally, the young porglets thrived on the oceanic planet of Kamino and the population grew exponentially. With a new cohort of Porgs numbering more than 200,000, our brave band of Resistance fighters is tasked with transporting the animals back to their home planet of Ach-Too. All the creatures are boarded onto a Hammerhead class ship for departure to their native world†. Just as the final Porg is loaded onto the Resistance craft, a First Order Dreadnought comes out of hyperspace above Kamino.

What will happen to our brave band of Resistance fighters?????


footnotes:

* Because bureaucracies are always organized in really strange ways, the Jedi Council are actually in charge of the Department of Intergalactic Fish and Wildlife. They also oversee the Department of Interstellar Trade, but we're well versed in those details...

† In a strange turn of events, Chewbacca approaches the Kaminoans and requests that a single Porg be separated from the flock to accompany him on the Millennium Falcon. See, it mirrors the events in Attack of the Clones! It's like poetry! Anywho, the Porg turns out to be a somewhat shoddy co-pilot, which we see via the events on Crait, but nonetheless, this odd couple is sure to have some great adventures.
 

Canon Editor

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I saw the film a second time today, and have clearer thoughts than those I had after my first viewing.  
Despite me loving the film at first, I now feel it is good.  The first two hours are slow or plain out boring, not (only) because of its slow pace -which isn’t too bad - but simply because of the Resistance subplot being overcomplicated.  I found that the film starts (where “starts” is the keyword) to finally pick up when Rose and Finn escape with the Fathiers.  I liked that.  
I felt the first two hours to oscillate between good scenes (such as the Yoda and Luke meeting, Kylo smashing his mask into the elevator’s wall, Luke and Rey’s scenes or Snoke’s meeting with Kylo), the unnecessary (Leia’s revival in space - which I didn’t despise in of itself - or Luke milking the creature or fishing on Ahch-To) and the boring, mainly related to the subplot of the Resistance.  
I actually quite liked the escape (escape) sequence on Canto Bight, but the film needs to be streamlined.  A lot.  I’m not saying a Star Wars film shouldn’t be layered or complex, but not complicated.  The Maz Kanata scene (although necessary, unfortunately), Leia’s unexplained Force revival and Holdo’s ambiguous position being dragged only to survey Poe’s failure arc (which I liked) do not simplify the narrative.  On the contrary, they complicate it or slow it down, when it is unnecessary, and the film screams to get back at Rey, Luke and Ben.  The best sequences of the film, the essential theme of the film lays there, and that is where the film succeeds and is ultimately brought above its mediocre first two hours: when the two stories finally merge, get up to pace and Kylo and Rey get a Holdo (pun intended) of the narrative.  

Overall, I love its positives, but cannot blind myself in front of its negatives, which “Star Wars: Episode VII - The Force Awakens” was excellent at hiding.
 
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