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Star Trek VGER Version 2

bionicbob

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Thanks for taking the time to post your thoughts [MENTION=24517]TheRackk[/MENTION], it is immensely appreciated. :)

Star Trek had been around along time and everyone has their own personal connection to it, and accordingly has their own preconceived ideas what they want out of a Trek story. Myself, I wanted to try to make the movies feel more like the original television series that I used to love to watch as a kid. As for the twist ending, that is a fan theory that has been floating around forever and I figured it was a fun way to give the story a fresh ending. Some like it, some don't. It is all cool. As they say, infinite diversity in infinite combinations. ;-)
 

valdora

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Well I will start by saying that I wanted to view this before, but after Bob has taken so much time to help me with own edit of this film I had to get round to it first.

I started my versions thread by saying "I am sure someone has done this before" and boy have they. It was funny to see the things that he and I edited the same and the differences. There were several things that made me slap my head and go "why didn't I think of that?" Examples of this include:

Making Decker the First Officer and not the replaced Captain. Saved time and really takes away the fact that Kirk is really a dick in the official two cuts.

Taking out McCoy and Illia's introduction scenes made so much sense. They were kinda pointless since you get all that information in later scenes for Illia and in the good Doctors chase you avoid the horrible disco fever get up.

Spock's meeting with the Vulcan masters being in flash back.

Another thing to mention is I LOVED the inclusion of the original series sound effects and music cues. Although this leads to my only real big criticism and that is that the two scores just don't mesh. Going from the 60's score to a full on orchestral movie one from Goldsmith is jarring. Also you didn't use the Motion Picture/TNG theme until the end so it made it very weird when all of a sudden that score came in. I might recommend in a future version dubbing the original series Enterprise or main theme over that end part.

Overall I really liked the flow and this really felt like a Star Trek episode. While my version seems more like an episode of Next Gen yours really feels like TOS. Major props for that.

It's hard not to compare it to my cut. But when I do all I can say is right now THIS is the best version of an episodic cut of TMP that you can get. It is better quality picture wise than mine, it uses a more original score and has some great ideas. Not that you shouldn't check mine out, I am just saying that until mine is finally polished/redone this is the bench mark I will work to.

I will certainly take some ideas like the commercial breaks and removing the intro scenes in account when reworking my own. But will do in my own way obviously.

All in all check this out folks. A must see for any Trekkie.
 

bionicbob

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THANK YOU [MENTION=24460]valdora[/MENTION] for posting your impressions. :)

Very happy you had a positive viewing experience.

I look forward to your version of TMP. We need more Trek edits!
 

Jaiman Tuckuh

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Watched version 2, trying to carve out time for V 1. I'll try to post some comparison notes.

valdora said:
Another thing to mention is I LOVED the inclusion of the original series sound effects and music cues. Although this leads to my only real big criticism and that is that the two scores just don't mesh. Going from the 60's score to a full on orchestral movie one from Goldsmith is jarring.

Strange that I never thought about that or noticed it. Even after you mentioned it, it didn't bug me. Weird.


Vulcan as a flashback was a stroke of genius. I was slapping my forehead, too. And it worked a whole lot better than I could've imagined. There was the added advantage of perking up a rather dull (but vital) scene.

Doesn't matter, I shelved the idea of me doing any episode-style movie edits. (Unless I should do Flashback + ST6. But Flashback offers a lot of reasons not to). My TMP "armchair edit" needs Vulcan at the beginning.


The interleaving of TOS music was awesome, of course.

Pacing vastly improved, of course.


May the Great Bird land on your planet, for removing the red cast from the Vger pit. :eek: I hadn't thought it could be restored to that degree. From your results, though, shots which looked monochrome red might well be.


I hold conflicting opinions on the ad fades. (Thus V1 is good to have). I wish they'd take fades out of consumer copies, wherever possible. But fade-downs mean musical choices that really sell the episodic idea.

In the real world, Phase II would've been edited on film, and the unused negatives would've likely been sold for silver. So it wouldn't actually be possible for them to remove the fades.


I'm gratified that you made the twist ending more subtle. I understand why it's the perfect sort of concept for a faneditor's rewrite. But I've despised the notion since it first hit Usenet.


One of many, many reasons: It shrinks the universe. Two awesome concepts, open to speculation {the form of Vger++, and the origin of the Borg} becomes one less-plausible concept.

(Not as badly as the old chestnut of making Tralane a Q. There, they'd be robbing TOS of an awesome concept, and there just wasn't enough TOS. Again, less plausible, and several other reasons).


The end-theme stills were great! The phase II uniforms they should have had in the movie. TOS used some unaired stills in their themes, too. E.g. The face peel from the blooper (Return to Tommorow), a neat scenery shot from "Consience of the King", and I think there was something from WALGMO.


The inevitable nitpick:
(Subjective) I noticed you use the classic red alert for Epsilon 9, and left the movie version on the Enterprise. Not implausible, with the refit. But I, personally, consider the 70's-synthesizer version a downgrade for the ship.

The not a nitpick sigh: I wish someone at CBS/Paramount would get around to giving Crecendo the go ahead to release more TOS CDs.
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bionicbob

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[MENTION=4617]Jaiman Tuckuh[/MENTION] THANK YOU for taking the time to post your thoughts.

I don't really think you need to go back and watch Version One, as it is 90% the same, including commercial breaks. The only real difference is Aspect Ratio, a couple different music cues, new twist ending FX and longer Vulcan Flashback. But beat for beat, it is the same core edit.

Glad you enjoyed the redesigned end credits. I was wondering if anyone would notice?!!? :D It was great fun to create.

Sorry the Twist Ending did not float your boat. Yes, it is Small Universe Syndrome but hey, it's a fun idea IMO and was the inspiration for the entire edit.;-)
 

Marjy

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Dwight Fry said:
Tried to download the dlc, but it asks me for a ftp password. :shock:

Hi BionicBob, I love your work and being a huge Trekkie your Star Trek stuff just amazes me! So, when I saw you had a 2nd release of the VGER incident I excitedly downloaded it.

Sadly for some reason though I'm being asked for a password to extract the file and I don't know what it would be? Is there something I'm doing wrong? It looks like Dwight had the same problem.

Any suggestions would be great.

thanks,
Marjy
 

Neglify

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Marjy said:
I'm being asked for a password to extract the file and I don't know what it would be?


From the fanedit.info FAQ:

An edit is password protected! How do I open it?
Try “fanedit.org” or “fanedited.com”.
 

bionicbob

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Marjy said:
Hi BionicBob, I love your work and being a huge Trekkie your Star Trek stuff just amazes me! So, when I saw you had a 2nd release of the VGER incident I excitedly downloaded it.

Hope you enjoy it. Love to hear your thoughts after viewing. :)
 

cowell903

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My guess is that the being that V'ger evolved into with Decker and Illia is somehow connected to the Borg?
 

bionicbob

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cowell903 said:
My guess is that the being that V'ger evolved into with Decker and Illia is somehow connected to the Borg?

Watch it and all shall be revealed. ;-)
 

bionicbob

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Thanks to [MENTION=8219]Jono11[/MENTION] for his review.

Having watched all six of Bob's TOS movie edits, I can definitely say that they're all recommended, and all of them make me WANT to say that they're my new go-too versions of the films they edit. With ST2, I'd say the original and Bob's version both have their merits. With ST3 through ST5, I'd say Bob's versions are slightly better (and when I say that, it's important to note that I liked the originals quite well), but I'd still recommend that people watch both from time to time.This edit is actually the most troubling, because while it does almost everything it needs to do in order to make the film more tightly paced and more focused on the proper characters, I feel that it actually cuts too much. Everything about it makes me want it to be my preferred version, because in basically every way it is a massive improvement over the one TOS film that I never really liked that much. There's just one problem: Decker has been cut too much. His choice at the end makes no sense because we've only seen hints of his feelings for Ilia--or, for that matter, his feelings about anything other than wanting command of the Enterprise. All we know about him in this edit is that he had a thing with Ilia and he wants his ship back. In that context, his actions at the end make no sense.Other than that, it's great. It's the film TMP should have been. Other than that.

Others too have mentioned they felt Decker's motivation for his final decision in the this fan edit is not as clear. And it is true, in order to strengthen Kirk's role I significantly cut Decker down. However, Decker does not have much of a substantive romantic role to begin with.... other than maybe keeping the scene where Ilia puts on the headdress and appears to connect with Decker, there is really nothing else cut that develops their relationship any further. I kept most of the "love lorn" looks between them and the turbo-lift scene is the only real exchange in the entire movie that "establishes" their relationship. If you really examine the original movie, the Ilia/Decker romance is very bland and flimsy.

You say: All we know about him in this edit is that he had a thing with Ilia and he wants his ship back.

I would argue that is all we know about Decker in the original version too and his final decision to bond with a machine which may contain the memories of his supposed true love is dodgy at best. But the writers had to remove Decker from the equation and leave Kirk in the command chair. Remember, this was originally a tv pilot script that only got minor rewrites when it was rushed from a tv production into a theatrical release. It is also one of the reasons Spock was written so cold, as the role was written for Xon, a pure blood non-emotional Vulcan.
But I agree, Decker's role did not have to be cut as much as I did, but it was the only way I could think of to re-establish Kirk as the Hero as much as possible.

Still, glad you enjoyed the majority of the edit. Thanks for taking the time to post your thoughts, it is greatly appreciated. :)
 

bionicbob

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And [MENTION=28628]Anarchemist[/MENTION] Trek marathon continues.....

Again, THANK YOU SO MUCH for such an incredible review!!!!

While I would not call this edit "flawless", I am extremely happy that you felt the new narrative worked so well.

TMP is definitely not an action movie. As you said, it is very cerebral. In many ways, of all the Trek movies, it is the most PURE in terms of being true Science Fiction -- exploring ideas and philosophy -- something Star Trek has always done extremely well in the television format, but often gets sidelined in the feature films.

Looking forward to your thoughts on Trek 4-6. :)
 

bionicbob

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Thank you [MENTION=26241]SKYflix[/MENTION] for taking the time to post your review, as always it is greatly appreciated.

I agree with your assessment that in my effort to bring the Trek Trinity to the forefront of the story, Decker and Illia got lost a bit in the edit shuffle. It was a tricky balancing act, and I think in retrospect, I favored too strongly towards increased pacing and a more Kirk-centric narrative and should have kept a bit more of the Decker/Illia relationship.

Glad you enjoyed the mythos twist ending, that was sheer fanboy fun and I must again thank [MENTION=6190]dkerin[/MENTION] for creating those very cool fx shots. :)

Again, thank you for the positive review.
 

SKYflix

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The twist is awesome!

To tell you the truth, when I saw the first added fx shot, I rewinded because I tought my eyes was playing trick on me. The FX is really good for this, subtle but revealing! I did it also for the second shot. :)

Again great work on your edit!
 

bionicbob

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A thank you to Billy Bumbags for taking the time to post a review.

Glad you had such a great time watching. :)
 

bionicbob

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Thanks. It is so nice to hear that my first ever fan edit is still getting some love after all these years. :D
 

bionicbob

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@"mnkykungfu" thanks for the review!

Wow!  That brought back a lot of memories.   Your comments are very fair.  Looking back, I still don't think I ever cracked how to make the edit I truly wanted.... but it was a lot of fun trying.
 
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