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Casino Royale: The Big Picture by Problem Eliminator

Neglify

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For the poster, since it's for a FAN-EDIT, I suggest putting the FAN-EDIT TITLE on the poster. Otherwise it's a useless recreation of a template poster.
 

Problem Eliminator

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DominicCobb said:
Don't know how I missed this, looks cool. CR is a top five Bond film for me (and my first in theaters too), but somehow I don't mind the thought of all these cuts. I actually watched the film on TV recently, and they (for whatever reason) cut out the car defibrillator scene. I didn't even notice! Guess it's not too important.

It's probably too late for a suggestion, but honestly if you're removing the "Bond begins" elements, why not remove the cold open? Replace it with the African rundown? It think it would be cool to see an edit that makes CR just another Bond film, rather than a reboot.
That's funny! The heart attack is almost entirely inconsequential to the story. I guess the one good purpose it serves is to re-establish that Vesper is on Bond's side (she hooks up the machine and revives him) after she has denied him the funds to keep playing poker. However, losing the "Vesper saves Bond" beat actually serves the purposes of my fanedit, so it's all good.

I considered moving the parkour to the pre-titles sequence, but I just couldn't lose the opening. It's one of my fav openings (after Goldfinger and OHMSS) - I wish the whole film had the same old school, low-key tone. It would also be tricky to concoct a new transition into the titles sequence, but I'm sure with some creativity it could be done.
 

TM2YC

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With it being Eurovision time again, I thought I'd suggest this mega-tune (That won last year's competition) as an alt Bond theme ...


(I'm gonna suggest it for every Bond edit until somebody uses it :-D)

hoBbGBb.png


There's an instrumental too...


It's sounds so Bond they should sue.
 

Problem Eliminator

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DominicCobb said:
Um, okay.
Sorry, had an issue with my browser and lost the post. Edited the post just now.

EDIT: Would anyone else like to see a preview of the edit before it's set in stone? PM me if interested, I'd love some feedback.
 

Problem Eliminator

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While I'm waiting to hear from the Academy, I thought I'd ask the community for some input on my edit.

At the end of the poker game, Bond has a little chat with Vesper next to the poker table. However, I had to cut this part because it contains a reference to Bond being poisoned (which I cut earlier). Then we move on to the Bond/Vesper dinner scene.

I'm wondering which transition (from casino to restaurant) works better - a hard cut or a cross dissolve.

Hard cut:



Cross dissolve:



I see pros and cons to both, and I don't know which is better. What do you think, fanediting folks
 

thecuddlyninja

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I much prefer the hard cut. I only think cross dissolves work when going to a dream or a credit or something other than a linear point in time but that may be just me.
 

TM2YC

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^ This. Hard cut is better. Add a subtle music cue to play across the cut and it'll be a little smoother.
 

Problem Eliminator

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Thanks for the input! I agree that dissolves work better for greater passages of time, entering dreams, credits, etc.

I'll see if there's anything good from the soundtrack that I can play over the cut.
 

Neglify

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Well I guess that Problem...

tumblr_mae0i0hsrF1qhrkxko1_r1_400.gif


... just got Eliminated.
 

Problem Eliminator

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I noticed that the faneditor of the Straight Flush Edition of Casino Royale, Kerr, had some preview clips on YouTube (airport sequence and sinking house sequence). So for comparison's sake, I thought I'd upload my version of the sinking house sequence for the community's perusal:


And while I'm here, I might as well ask for some more feedback! I'm wondering about some scenes featuring M.

The first clip in question is M confronting Bond in her apartment. In this scene, my intention is to create a more traditional Bond/M relationship, which doesn't include trust issues. I've removed M's line "I knew it was too early to promote you" and removed M preaching about arrogance, ego and trust. What results is probably the most awkward cut in my edit! Judge for yourself and tell me your thoughts:


The clip finishes with Bond's arrival in Nassau, sans the Ford Mondeo commercial. I had to redo the music and add new SFX here, and I'm quite proud of how it turned out.

Next up is M briefing Bond on his mission. The biggest change here is the removal of M placing a tracking chip in Bond's arm. Again, I'm trying to drop the Bond/M trust issues. I have two concerns here: 1) is the cut from Bond & M in the corridor to the gazebo awkward? and 2) after the removal of the tracking chip implant, does M's line "Don't worry about keeping in touch, we'll know where you are" still work? Check it out below:


Thanks for taking a look.
 

dangermouse

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PE I've dumped my comments here so that you can respond here as well - also useful for anyone else watching the film.
These were my comments to PE after watching....

Jotted down some notes as follows...
AV quality, sound quality good, editing is good, but overall I think you've cut too much and so the film is too jumpy.

Been cut too heavily. For example, he gets the key to the car, gets in the car... and then jump cut to arriving at lunch with Mathis...with Vesper? How did she get there?

Bug tracking is at the wrong time - Le Chiffe gets called and leaves, then Bond places the bug, then he can track him.
Quite a few obvious areas where cuts were made. Not visual or auditory, just pauses or jumps in the conversation which make it obvious something has been cut.

I think cutting M's suspicion was a mistake. He's a rookie, who screwed up - she would be unsure if she'd judged right after his bombmaker episode.

All the action beats are solidly cut.

Why did you cut the password being vesper? - you left it in at the beginning. It's a big point in her realising she can trust Bond.

If you could dial back some of the more heavy-handed cuts, then this would be a solid fanedit. As it stands there's a few areas where the editor's hand is too visible, and has created logic or flow errors.

However, I must say I enjoyed the film, and I was impressed with your editing skills. CR is a bit bloated!
 

Problem Eliminator

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Feedback! Yahoo! :dance:

dangermouse said:
I think you've cut too much and so the film is too jumpy.
Oh no, my worst fears confirmed!

dangermouse said:
Been cut too heavily. For example, he gets the key to the  car, gets in  the car... and then jump cut to arriving at lunch with  Mathis...with  Vesper? How did she get there?
Hmm. The original scene goes like this:

a.) Bond sits in Aston
b.) opens envelope telling him about the new car and then says "I love you too M"
c.) looks at the defibrillator and combi-pens
d.) retrieves gun from car
e.) exits the car
f.) cut to Bond & Vesper meeting Mathis

I didn't want to keep this scene, for three reasons:


  • I don't appreciate that M has to give him a car - the Aston is Bond's signature car (on that same note, I tried mighty hard to cut Bond winning the DB5 from Dimitrios, but it just didn't work).
  • Defibrillator isn't used later in the film.
  • Bond retrieves his gun here, but then he retrieves it again from reception later... I'm not sure why the film repeats this beat, but cutting it here made sense to me.

My version, for those playing along at home ;) Arguably, the original film doesn't play out any more logically. He exits the car, then we cut to Bond & Vesper meeting Mathis. So what happened there? I guess he collected Vesper from the hotel, then went back out to the car so they could meet Mathis. In my version, I think a similar sequence of events is suggested - perhaps Bond pulls the Aston up to the hotel, collects Vesper, then they leave together.

Perhaps I'll give Bond something to do in the car, so the scene has more of a purpose. Then he can also step out of the car, too. I'll see what I can do.

dangermouse said:
Bug tracking is at the wrong time - Le Chiffe gets called and leaves, then Bond places the bug, then he can track him.
If you check my list of changes, I didn't actually touch that part of the film!

dangermouse said:
I think cutting M's suspicion  was a mistake. He's a rookie, who screwed  up - she would be unsure if  she'd judged right after his bombmaker  episode.
You might recall that my intention was to eliminate the Bond-as-rookie stuff. I suppose either I've not succeeded in my intention, or perhaps your prior knowledge of the film is colouring your perception of the fanedit. Not sure which - maybe both. What do you think? I'm considering retooling some of the Bond/M stuff, so we'll see what happens here.

dangermouse said:
All the action beats are solidly cut.
Thanks.

dangermouse said:
Why  did you cut the password being vesper? - you left it in at the   beginning. It's a big point in her realising she can trust Bond.
I did keep Bond entering a password in the casino, yes, because Mendel asked him to. However, I cut his knowing smile before typing the password, which is the only reference to the password being "Vesper." (The keys Bond hits don't even spell Vesper, btw - a minor goof in the original film).

Anyway, why I cut this part... a couple reasons:


  • Bond using "Vesper" as his password is adolescent and unprofessional, and I'm trying to make him more mature. The script might have been "young Bond," but Craig is definitely not "young Bond."
  • He names his signature martini "Vesper" as well, and I think that sufficiently displays how taken Bond is with her.

As for Vesper trusting Bond... I'm trying to cut the (IMO) superficial thread of "trust" that runs through the script. I don't think it's a theme that emerges naturally from the story. When M tells Bond "I need to know I can trust you, and that you know who to trust" - to me, that's just clumsy, ugly writing that forces nearly non-existent subtext into character's mouths. Anyway, I could prattle on about this, but maybe some other time.

dangermouse said:
However, I must say I enjoyed the film, and I was impressed with your editing skills. CR is a bit bloated!
I'm glad you enjoyed it overall! I appreciate the time you took to view and give feedback.

dangermouse said:
Quite  a few obvious areas where cuts were  made. Not visual or auditory,  just  pauses or jumps in the conversation  which make it obvious  something has  been cut.
Any others you can recall that you haven't mentioned? This is good stuff for me to know.

Well, it's been almost a year since I started this fanedit! It's definitely been a learning experience. I'm eager to kick the project out of the nest and move on with my life... but other than dangermouse, I've only received feedback from friends and family. So is there anyone else who would be willing to do a comprehensive, detailed review? It's a bit of an undertaking, for sure, but it would be really valuable for me and I'd appreciate it.
 

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Actually, with the car just cut out receiving the keys and cut straight to meeting Matis? The way you have it cut we expect something to happen with the car.
Re the bug tracking - maybe it's because you cut something inbetween? Maybe the defibrillator or something. It really doesn't flow right. I'll have to check the original!
You've cut out nearly all of the relationship with M, but you've kept in the beginning with the double-O. If you don't want the young Bond then I think that has to go? If not, then put back the concern that M has with Bond, especially considering his first mission (ONE bomb-maker) was a complete shambles.
 

Problem Eliminator

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dangermouse said:
Actually, with the car just cut out receiving the keys and cut straight to meeting Matis? The way you have it cut we expect something to happen with the car.
Re the bug tracking - maybe it's because you cut something inbetween? Maybe the defibrillator or something. It really doesn't flow right. I'll have to check the original!
You've cut out nearly all of the relationship with M, but you've kept in the beginning with the double-O. If you don't want the young Bond then I think that has to go? If not, then put back the concern that M has with Bond, especially considering his first mission (ONE bomb-maker) was a complete shambles.
I've made some updates to my edit this week, based on your feedback:

1. Bond now sits in the Aston and reads the file accompanying the car, then goes back to the hotel.

2. When Bond breaks into M's apartment, she says "I need to know I can trust you." Later, she puts a tracking chip in his arm (it is removed when Le Chiffre picks Bond up after his car crash.) I've reinstated these elements to give the Bond/M relationship more tension to be resolved by film's end, as Bond and M are still building their working relationship.


On a related note - I've done some thinking about the "origin story" business in Casino Royale. This is the conclusion I've come to: it's not the fact that CR is an "origin story" that bothers me (Fleming's novel set up the character for further adventures, too). It's not even that Bond is a new 00 (that's not the case in the novel, but it's a wise choice when adapting the story of how Bond is forged).

Rather, what bothers me are these implications: that Bond is a murderous thug (he's not a hitman - he worked in the Navy and Secret Service for years before getting 00 status); that Bond is a young man and/or rookie agent (Craig is clearly not, both in look and demeanor); and that such unprofessional hostility would exist between Bond and his superior (some trust issues are understandable, but not to the extent the original film depicts).


These are the changes I made to address these issues:

Bond is not a murderous thug
- trimmed Bond smiling after killing Carlos
- cut Bond's line “Do you want a clean kill or do you want to send a message?”

Bond is not a young man and/or rookie agent
- cut M's line “I knew it was too early to promote you”
- cut M’s lecture about arrogance and ego
- cut Vesper giving Bond a tailored dinner jacket (a "Bond Begins" gimmick... he knows how to dress himself)
- in regards to martini, cut Bond's line “That’s not half bad, I’m gonna have to think of a name for that” (another gimmick... this is not the first of his signature martinis)
- cut lines about Bond learning "lessons"

Bond/M relationship is less hostile
- cut M ranting about Bond in Parliament
- cut Bond using M’s name and password on MI6 website
- cut M's line “What the hell are you up to?” when Bond phones from Miami International
- cut M's line “Trust me, I wish it wasn’t the case” after saying Bond is the Service's best bet for beating Le Chiffre at poker


So to summarize, my refocused intention is that Bond is a new 00, but he's not a young man or a rookie agent. I hope that my edit realizes this intention - but that will be for you to decide! :dance:

PS. Will be posting some previews and colour correction comparisons in the coming days. Stay tuned!
 

Problem Eliminator

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Here are some more previews for anyone who is interested...

Vesper's Introduction
In this scene, I've tried to make the conversation sound less scripted.


End of Poker Game (No Heart Attack)

In this stretch of the film, I've removed Bond's heart attack. After Bond is staked by Leiter, the poker game continues uninterrupted until its conclusion.


Final Conversation with M

In this scene, I've removed Bond's suggestion that Mathis might still be guilty, as well as the crap about Bond learning a lesson (trust no one).


Let me know what you think!
 

Zarius

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Good cuts, did'nt feel like anything was missing.
 

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PE - I'd cut the "at least this clears Mathias". The pause there is a bit too long. Otherwise plays out really well.
The Vesper v Bond scene is brilliant. Much stronger than the original.
Card game sans heart failure is great too.
 

Problem Eliminator

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Zarius said:
Good cuts, did'nt feel like anything was missing.
Thank you!

dangermouse said:
PE - I'd cut the "at least this clears Mathias". The pause there is a bit too long. Otherwise plays out really well.
The Vesper v Bond scene is brilliant. Much stronger than the original.
Card game sans heart failure is great too.
I'll check that part out again. And I'm glad you liked the clips!
 
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