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Doctor Who

keithbk

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I own the Doctor Who store in America (Who North America) and the current series has done nothing to increase the fanbase; it has only declined.

The last fiscally hot year for Doctor Who, as a retailer, was the 50th anniversary year (2013). Once Matt Smith exited in 2014, the series took a HUGE fanbase hit, which has only declined with the current Doctor.

This is NOT a review of any episodes, but merely an observation based on our own level of business. We have been in the Doctor Who business since 1998. Right now, things are very bad for us.
 

Handman

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Absolutely.  I remember that anniversary year, Doctor Who was the hot thing everyone was watching.  It was unsustainable, because it was the trendy thing to watch and trends never last.  But it is interesting to note the continual decline.
 

Hymie

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keithbk said:
I own the Doctor Who store in America (Who North America) and the current series has done nothing to increase the fanbase; it has only declined.

The last fiscally hot year for Doctor Who, as a retailer, was the 50th anniversary year (2013). Once Matt Smith exited in 2014, the series took a HUGE fanbase hit, which has only declined with the current Doctor.

This is NOT a review of any episodes, but merely an observation based on our own level of business. We have been in the Doctor Who business since 1998. Right now, things are very bad for us.

I'm sorry to hear the store is suffering, I have purchased a few items over the years from the store and have had no complaints but the lack of newer things has left me with little use to your store, unfortunately.

Do you think it has to do in the general public interest of the show or the fact that Character Options can't sell their toys in the US anymore?  I think people truly underestimate that despite how good Capaldi was in the role, it hurt the brand as no one seemed to know how to market the show anymore with an older lead and a lack of merchandise hurts the general public's interest.  Its amazing to think what a behemoth the show was during the Smith years in the USA, but after the 50th it seemed people moved on, likely to Star Wars or Game of Thrones.
 

Zarius

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Handman said:
Absolutely.  I remember that anniversary year, Doctor Who was the hot thing everyone was watching.  It was unsustainable, because it was the trendy thing to watch and trends never last.  But it is interesting to note the continual decline.

I have bittersweet memories of 2013, it wasn't a very kind year to me, and on top of that the second half of series seven really soured me on the programme for the first time. It was just woefully bad...you know you're in trouble when Gatiss has the best episode that year. The Day of the Doctor was a worthy special, but then it crapped the bed again with Matt's departure in Time of the Doctor.
 

Handman

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Yeah, series 7 was not the best the new show has to offer.  Thankfully it got better.
 

keithbk

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Hymie said:
keithbk said:
I own the Doctor Who store in America (Who North America) and the current series has done nothing to increase the fanbase; it has only declined.

The last fiscally hot year for Doctor Who, as a retailer, was the 50th anniversary year (2013). Once Matt Smith exited in 2014, the series took a HUGE fanbase hit, which has only declined with the current Doctor.

This is NOT a review of any episodes, but merely an observation based on our own level of business. We have been in the Doctor Who business since 1998. Right now, things are very bad for us.

I'm sorry to hear the store is suffering, I have purchased a few items over the years from the store and have had no complaints but the lack of newer things has left me with little use to your store, unfortunately.

Do you think it has to do in the general public interest of the show or the fact that Character Options can't sell their toys in the US anymore?  I think people truly underestimate that despite how good Capaldi was in the role, it hurt the brand as no one seemed to know how to market the show anymore with an older lead and a lack of merchandise hurts the general public's interest.  Its amazing to think what a behemoth the show was during the Smith years in the USA, but after the 50th it seemed people moved on, likely to Star Wars or Game of Thrones.

Character made some questionable moves during the Matt Smith era with figures; they produced a lot of figures from weaker episodes, but failed to produce any for some of the better episodes. This resulted in an over-abundance of figures like Smilers, Peter the Winder, Hawthorne, Uncle, Peg Soldier, etc that no one really wanted. Meanwhile, we never got a Rory until AFTER he departed the program. Many shows that were superior had no figures released at all. Then they changed scales from 5.5" to the 3" figures. That is a story in and of itself.

Almost all of the US producers of product have dropped the license or scaled back. Character produces few figures, and often they end up being exclusives to stores like B&M in the UK. That makes it hard to obtain product.

We still see lots of audios released from Big Finish, a monthly magazine, but everything else is few and far between.
 

Hymie

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Yeah, as a somewhat collector it really was disappointing to see how the line fizzled out during the era.  I guess I got in at the right time as much of the line was already dead and I was able to get some really good deals on a number of things.  I hope the line picks up again, but with the public sentiment the way it is lately it seems unlikely.
 

asterixsmeagol

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Deadline said:
The BBC’s drama chief Piers Wenger has defended Doctor Who following a drop in ratings and a mixed reception from fans for Season 12 of the sci-fi drama. At a BBC drama even in London on Monday, Wenger was asked if he would consider resting Doctor Who given some of the malaise around the show, which is produced by BBC Studios and airs in the U.S. on BBC America. Wenger offered a strong rebuttal in which he argued that the Time Lord franchise, starring Jodie Whittaker and overseen by showrunner Chris Chibnall, is in fine fettle.​
 

Hymie

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The show is still high in the ratings, considering its been on for 12 years and gone through several leads, and is huge moneymaker for the BBC due to being able to sell it abroad.  Not to mention the advertising it does to help move Classic Who products and other deals such as streaming rights.  Even if interest still isn't nearly as broad as it once was, its still pretty steady and there is no reason why the BBC would want to lose a show like DW over the possibility of an unknown.
 

TomH1138

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Honestly, all the interest I've seen has been up this season from last. "Spyfall" and "Fugitive of the Judoon" finally seemed to generate some much-needed positive buzz, at least on the social media pages I've been following.

It seems like every single year, a news site claims that the ratings have fallen catastrophically, and ask (either rhetorically or to the head of the BBC) if the show is going to get cancelled. I've seen these articles constantly since I started watching over a decade ago. I think the news sites just like the clicks they get. 

(But no harm in letting us know what's being said by Deadline. Thanks for sharing the link, Asterix!)
 

TM2YC

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asterixsmeagol said:
Deadline said:
The BBC’s drama chief Piers Wenger has defended Doctor Who following a drop in ratings and a mixed reception from fans for Season 12 of the sci-fi drama. At a BBC drama even in London on Monday, Wenger was asked if he would consider resting Doctor Who given some of the malaise around the show, which is produced by BBC Studios and airs in the U.S. on BBC America. Wenger offered a strong rebuttal in which he argued that the Time Lord franchise, starring Jodie Whittaker and overseen by showrunner Chris Chibnall, is in fine fettle.​

 
11f47af2f78a071866b08bb5aa1f8cf0.jpg


I'm hoping next weeks episode lives up to the potential. Doctor + Master + Gallifrey + Cyber War

Did anybody else get the vibe that they were hinting Graham would die?

The official channel posted this terrific Gallifrey retrospective:


I hadn't realised that they'd kept a number of the same actors for different episodes, they've been so few and far between. Still got my fingers crossed that this time they'll bring it back permanently.

Is there a hint in there that The Master is that old man shepherding people through the vortex? or am I imagining it.
 

Zarius

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TomH1138 said:
Honestly, all the interest I've seen has been up this season from last. "Spyfall" and "Fugitive of the Judoon" finally seemed to generate some much-needed positive buzz, at least on the social media pages I've been following.

It seems like every single year, a news site claims that the ratings have fallen catastrophically, and ask (either rhetorically or to the head of the BBC) if the show is going to get cancelled. I've seen these articles constantly since I started watching over a decade ago. I think the news sites just like the clicks they get. 

(But no harm in letting us know what's being said by Deadline. Thanks for sharing the link, Asterix!)
The Beeb said similar things in 1989. We all know what happened then.

As @"TM2YC"  indicated, it's all politics and trying to curry favour with the public because the Beeb are under threat from the goverment. What else is he going to say? He's not going to admit there's a problem, that isn't how the BBC operate. If they're going to cancel something, they'll say it's to "pursue new programming" or "open up the schedules", they'll never say "we're cancelling it because half the population of Britain thinks it's a bit s*it"

Social media is not a large representation of the country (thank goodness) and the buzz from Spyfall and Judoon had more to do with member berries than it did genuine storytelling.

Ratings are not healthy, the average consolidated figures are lower than they were last year, so you can't even rely on them for consistency when arguing against the absolutely petty live overnight figures. There is growing apathy towards the show, there are letter-writing campaigns being organised. 

The show has been officially 'rested' several times in the Nu Who era, all without cancelling it. People thought the 18 month hiatus in Colin Baker's era was extreme? We've had it worse since then all without the show being axed. 

I sadly think so long as the Beeb are committed to the programme  that the fans will just accept anything that doesn't keep it off our screens for more than a year or two, regardless of diminished interest, as a 'victory', and won't dare challenge the show to step up a bit and take back the audience it's lost.

But them, there's no guarantee of anything...if the licence fee gets cut, so will Doctor Who. Wenger might not even have a job by the end of all the reviews coming up this spring, so his word isn't gospel either.
 

keithbk

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TomH1138 said:
Honestly, all the interest I've seen has been up this season from last. "Spyfall" and "Fugitive of the Judoon" finally seemed to generate some much-needed positive buzz, at least on the social media pages I've been following.

It seems like every single year, a news site claims that the ratings have fallen catastrophically, and ask (either rhetorically or to the head of the BBC) if the show is going to get cancelled. I've seen these articles constantly since I started watching over a decade ago. I think the news sites just like the clicks they get. 

(But no harm in letting us know what's being said by Deadline. Thanks for sharing the link, Asterix!)

It is not translating to retail sales.

During the Eccleston-Matt Smith era, we did 1 million in business every 14 months.  

Now, we are struggling to do $20,000/month.

The merchandise license-holders have dropped to just a handful of remaining companies, and they rarely produce new product. 

There is no demand.
 

addiesin

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Really enjoyed episodes 4 and 5!

The stupid BBC America App plays this one commercial specifically for (and spoiling) this season of Doctor Who, and that's really stupid. It played about ten times while I watched these two episodes. Dumb spoilery marketing aside, I still was really surprised and impressed with the end of episode 5. 

6 was ok. Not my favorite but not terrible. I was just glad to get through to an episode that came out after the dumb commercial was made.
 

TomH1138

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Zarius said:
 
TomH1138 said:
(Sorry, I can't get rid of this block for some reason.
The Beeb said similar things in 1989. We all know what happened then.

Well, sure. The show absolutely can get cancelled. And of course no one at the BBC will say that things are going poorly. I wouldn't expect that. Nonetheless, I've become numb to all the cancellation articles. Just like the regenerations, the actual cancellation will probably happen after all the news sites stop reporting about it.  :p

And social media doesn't represent everybody, but I didn't see any excitement or anything other than animosity during Season 11, so even a relatively small positive buzz suggested to me that things were at least going better for the BBC than last season. YMMV.

Also, ratings for broadcast are down overall everywhere, as people get their entertainment from streaming sites and online purchases of episodes, etc.

Mind you, I'm not super enthused about the show myself. I've only caught a small handful of episodes since the Season 11 premiere, and even when I do feel like watching it, it's hard to find others who will watch with me. So this isn't me saying, "I think the show is still amazing; therefore, it can't possibly be struggling in the ratings." Plenty of shows that I think are better than current DW were nonetheless ratings turkeys. It happens. 

I didn't make my earlier statement (or this one) to pick on people who don't like the show now (especially when I'm somewhat ambivalent about it myself). I'm just exhausted from all the dire news articles, and if the cancellation actually happens this time, it will have no more or less to do with this article than any article that came before it. 

I hope I was more clear this time.

Just my two...um...Republic credits? Um...Gallifreyan...space-bucks, or something?  :D
 

TomH1138

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keithbk said:
TomH1138 said:
Honestly, all the interest I've seen has been up this season from last. "Spyfall" and "Fugitive of the Judoon" finally seemed to generate some much-needed positive buzz, at least on the social media pages I've been following.

It seems like every single year, a news site claims that the ratings have fallen catastrophically, and ask (either rhetorically or to the head of the BBC) if the show is going to get cancelled. I've seen these articles constantly since I started watching over a decade ago. I think the news sites just like the clicks they get. 

(But no harm in letting us know what's being said by Deadline. Thanks for sharing the link, Asterix!)

It is not translating to retail sales.

During the Eccleston-Matt Smith era, we did 1 million in business every 14 months.  

Now, we are struggling to do $20,000/month.

The merchandise license-holders have dropped to just a handful of remaining companies, and they rarely produce new product. 

There is no demand.

Really? That's fascinating. Again, that's the opposite of what I've heard. Even people who say that the show isn't doing well usually say that the show will stay on the air for all the great merchandise sales alone.

But it sounds like you're speaking from experience. What retailer do you work for?
 

keithbk

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TomH1138 said:
keithbk said:
TomH1138 said:
Honestly, all the interest I've seen has been up this season from last. "Spyfall" and "Fugitive of the Judoon" finally seemed to generate some much-needed positive buzz, at least on the social media pages I've been following.

It seems like every single year, a news site claims that the ratings have fallen catastrophically, and ask (either rhetorically or to the head of the BBC) if the show is going to get cancelled. I've seen these articles constantly since I started watching over a decade ago. I think the news sites just like the clicks they get. 

(But no harm in letting us know what's being said by Deadline. Thanks for sharing the link, Asterix!)

It is not translating to retail sales.

During the Eccleston-Matt Smith era, we did 1 million in business every 14 months.  

Now, we are struggling to do $20,000/month.

The merchandise license-holders have dropped to just a handful of remaining companies, and they rarely produce new product. 

There is no demand.

Really? That's fascinating. Again, that's the opposite of what I've heard. Even people who say that the show isn't doing well usually say that the show will stay on the air for all the great merchandise sales alone.

But it sounds like you're speaking from experience. What retailer do you work for?

I own Who North America, http://www.whona.com
 

Hymie

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TomH1138 said:
keithbk said:
TomH1138 said:
Honestly, all the interest I've seen has been up this season from last. "Spyfall" and "Fugitive of the Judoon" finally seemed to generate some much-needed positive buzz, at least on the social media pages I've been following.

It seems like every single year, a news site claims that the ratings have fallen catastrophically, and ask (either rhetorically or to the head of the BBC) if the show is going to get cancelled. I've seen these articles constantly since I started watching over a decade ago. I think the news sites just like the clicks they get. 

(But no harm in letting us know what's being said by Deadline. Thanks for sharing the link, Asterix!)

It is not translating to retail sales.

During the Eccleston-Matt Smith era, we did 1 million in business every 14 months.  

Now, we are struggling to do $20,000/month.

The merchandise license-holders have dropped to just a handful of remaining companies, and they rarely produce new product. 

There is no demand.

Really? That's fascinating. Again, that's the opposite of what I've heard. Even people who say that the show isn't doing well usually say that the show will stay on the air for all the great merchandise sales alone.

As been mentioned, merchandise from the show has all but disappeared for the most part, no where near the levels they were a decade ago. Where Who makes its money is selling the show worldwide to different broadcasters.  Getting BBC America involved with the show has lead it to expand its budget and now animate missing episodes which they can use to exploit the classic serials and make money on DVD and Blu-Ray releases.
 

Zarius

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My review (left this on a couple of forums)

Pretty simple story really. Cyber-Lords looked hilarious, the concept is interesting, but they're really just drones. Ashad boiled down to nothing (were they flogging merchandise with Ashad's compressed form or something? At one point I was expecting the Teleshopping information to come up on screen)

I liked how they really teased Jodie was going to leave with this one, only for an old-school trope to emerge in one of the disposable human cast making the grand sacrifice instead.

Boy were the Cybermen lousy shots.

Does Chibnall 'ship Graham and Yaz? Jail bait Bradley.

The new origin for The Doctor isn't too bad, the Brendan stuff, a captivating part of the first instalment, is dismissed pretty sharply here as meaning very little. Shame.

Ruth remains an enigma..as does most of The Doctor's past in 'The division'.

Dawhan steals the whole story, but too much continuity porn, exposition, and wasted potential. Probably not going to hold interest on repeated viewing unless you're watching a reaction channel
 
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