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Blu-ray -> MakeMKV -> ??? -> Premiere Pro
#1
I've looked around the forums, but I'm having trouble finding much information pertaining to Premiere Pro. ThrowgnCpr's guide seems to revolve around converting to an AVI using the Lagarith codec, but I don't believe Premiere Pro can even import that.

I'm also not sure what the point of converting to a Lagarith AVI would even be—isn't the video contained within the MKV already lossless? There's already an MP4 in there, and Premiere Pro can open that. If I use
Code:
ffmpeg -codec copy
to simply remux (if I'm using the right term) the MKV to MP4, I can open that in Premiere Pro. That should be good to go for editing, correct? Though the DTS audio isn't read by Premiere Pro, which brings me to my next question...

What do I need to do about the audio? I only see 6 audio channels in Premiere Pro, so I assume that would be for 5.1 audio. My Blu-ray provides 7.1 DTS.

So, basically, what do I need to do to get from MakeMKV into Premiere Pro for editing?

If I need to provide any further information, I'm away from my computer at the moment, but will try to answer any questions from memory until I get home this evening. Then I can provide detail.

Thanks!
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#2
(01-08-2018, 04:28 PM)ttamnedlog Wrote: but I don't believe Premiere Pro can even import that


It can. Older versions of Premiere handled it easier than h264 on slower machines, guess that was the point back then. Newer Premieres handle demuxed Blu-ray video better, again, depending on your computer speed. I haven't used MakeMKV, but you can try to demux Blu-ray video and audio (I use tsMuxeR), then split 5.1 or 7.1 chanels to separate mono files with eac3to.



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#3
(01-08-2018, 04:28 PM)ttamnedlog Wrote: I've looked around the forums, but I'm having trouble finding much information pertaining to Premiere Pro. ThrowgnCpr's guide seems to revolve around converting to an AVI using the Lagarith codec, but I don't believe Premiere Pro can even import that.

It can, but you need to install the lagarith codec on your system

(01-08-2018, 04:28 PM)ttamnedlog Wrote: I'm also not sure what the point of converting to a Lagarith AVI would even be—isn't the video contained within the MKV already lossless?

The MKV doesn't contain a lossless stream. MakeMKV demuxes/remuxes the AVC or VC-1 encoded video stream (lossy/compressed) from a blu-ray into an MKV container. Some NLEs handle compressed streams better than others, but it has been in my experience that using a lossless stream avoids these potential issues.
--------------------------: My Fanedits :--------------------------
Because You Were Home (the Strangers)

-------------------------: Consecutions :-------------------------
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#4
(01-08-2018, 05:15 PM)ThrowgnCpr Wrote: The MKV doesn't contain a lossless stream. MakeMKV demuxes/remuxes the AVC or VC-1 encoded video stream (lossy/compressed) from a blu-ray into an MKV container. Some NLEs handle compressed streams better than others, but it has been in my experience that using a lossless stream avoids these potential issues.

Ahh, that's right. Well assuming my PC/editor can handle the file just fine and not experience the issues you reference, do I gain anything by transcoding (if I'm using the right term again, ha) to lossless?
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#5
(01-08-2018, 05:38 PM)ttamnedlog Wrote: Ahh, that's right. Well assuming my PC/editor can handle the file just fine and not experience the issues you reference, do I gain anything by transcoding (if I'm using the right term again, ha) to lossless?

The benefit of using the original lossy file is that it's less resource intensive. The downside is that you can sometimes experience glitches in your timeline or render, or have issues with color space settings.

On the flip side, you can essentially eliminate glitches caused by using lossy media, but a lossless lagarith file takes up a lot of hard drive space and can be resource intensive to edit.

If you have a powerful machine and enough HDD space, I'd recommend going with the lossless. If you don't have an abundance of either of those things, try your hand at the original lossy file.


JEDIT: I always create 2 lagarith AVI files for movies I am editing. One is the original 1080p, and the other is a low-resolution (360p or 480p) copy. I do all my editing on the low-res version, because it uses significantly less resources, and then I replace the source file with the 1080p before I do my final render.
--------------------------: My Fanedits :--------------------------
Because You Were Home (the Strangers)

-------------------------: Consecutions :-------------------------
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#6
(01-08-2018, 05:47 PM)ThrowgnCpr Wrote: If you have a powerful machine and enough HDD space, I'd recommend going with the lossless. If you don't have an abundance of either of those things, try your hand at the original lossy file.

I believe I've got the power, but I am a little pressed for space! I'll see what I can do.

This might be beyond the scope of my thread, but why is Lagarith the popular choice here over other codecs? In googling, I see FFV1 and Huffyuv mentioned often. Maybe they serve different purposes?
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#7
(01-08-2018, 05:59 PM)ttamnedlog Wrote: This might be beyond the scope of my thread, but why is Lagarith the popular choice here over other codecs? In googling, I see FFV1 and Huffyuv mentioned often. Maybe they serve different purposes?

It's complicated, and I'm not an expert. I think it is a combination of compatibility and lossless compression ratios. Additionally, unlike some other lossless codecs, lagarith supports null frames.

Scientific paper comparing various lossless codecs, including those you mentioned:
https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/929e/69...f793f0.pdf

I recall using Huffyuv a long time ago (like 10 years) but had some issue at the time. Feel free to experiment and report back to us!
--------------------------: My Fanedits :--------------------------
Because You Were Home (the Strangers)

-------------------------: Consecutions :-------------------------
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#8
I typically use the M2TS file from the Blu-ray in Premiere and have never had a problem. Instead of just ripping the movie from the BR using MakeMKV use the backup option instead. Once that's done look in the folder for the largest M2TS file as this will most likely be the movie. You can then import that file into Premiere.
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#9
(01-08-2018, 05:47 PM)ThrowgnCpr Wrote: JEDIT: I always create 2 lagarith AVI files for movies I am editing. One is the original 1080p, and the other is a low-resolution (360p or 480p) copy. I do all my editing on the low-res version, because it uses significantly less resources, and then I replace the source file with the 1080p before I do my final render.
I believe Premiere has a feature where it will generate low res proxies to edit with. I've never used it, but was going to look into it for this. I think it works as you described.

(01-08-2018, 06:57 PM)Q2 Wrote: I typically use the M2TS file from the Blu-ray in Premiere and have never had a problem. Instead of just ripping the movie from the BR using MakeMKV use the backup option instead. Once that's done look in the folder for the largest M2TS file as this will most likely be the movie. You can then import that file into Premiere.
Oh, that does seem to work. No audio, but I guess I can follow other steps for audio. Especially if I want them in multiple mono tracks.
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#10
Lagarith was always a popular choice here because it has an RGB mode and therefore works well with Vegas, in which it decodes to and expects to see "computer RGB", at least with all the versions that I've used.  (It also works well with Premiere.)  Years ago, fewer lossless codecs supported RGB.  It also compresses well and is reasonably fast.

UT Video is the main alternative. It tends to be my choice on the rare occasions when I use an NLE.  It's faster, and some favor its lossless compression scheme for highly technical reasons, but the file-sizes are significantly bigger than those of Lagarith, and from the faneditor's perspective, there's not much in it.

Support for editing in YUV is undoubtedly better than it was.  If you know how your NLE handles your chosen codec in terms of levels, you can try it, but make sure you take care with levels when compositing or doing effects work and when you recompress back to a delivery format.

The safest workflow remains the following:

Code:
source files →  decoding to "computer RGB" (in AviSynth) → editing → rendering in RGB → conversion to YUV (in AviSynth) → encoder
Non sum qualis eram.

Captain Khajiit's Basic Guide to Decoding Video and Audio
Captain Khajiit's Quick Guide to Encoding a BD via the Command-line
Captain Khajiit's Basic Guide to Encoding with HCenc

For tech support, PM me (politely) or use the @+username function: I rarely read through threads these days.
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