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A guide to participating in (and moderating) and international forum

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dangermouse

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The recent discussion on the term "Mary Sue" threw up an interesting angle on this forum. All the US moderators reacted strongly to the term "Mary Sue" and claimed it was "inherently sexist".
Let me illustrate why this is a problematic stance to take.

Americans find the n-word incredibly racist and offensive. It is forbidden to use and will label you a racist. Unless, of course, you're an African-American talking to other African-Americans (this I learned from watching Rush Hour. Apparently being Chinese and using the n-word will mean getting involved in an entertaining fight)
But it is a word unique to America and American history. It's not *inherently* racist. But it IS racist for Americans.
Also, since American culture pervades the rest of the world, most of us internationals are aware of the meaning of the word, and would generally steer clear of it, even though it has no particular racist connotations for us.

I grew up in South Africa. The n-word is rather benign there. That may seem surprising, given Apartheid and all that. But it is culture that imbues a word with meaning. And the n-word is an *American* word. If in South Africa you want to offend someone in the same way as you would in America by using the n-word, you'd use the k-word.
Now many of you reading this probably don't have a clue what the k-word is. In fact, you may read some Herman Charles Bosman and then innocently repeat the use of the k-word without knowing that it is incredibly offensive and demeaning, and that you have just outed yourself as a KKK-level racist. If you were South African I would rightly condemn you. If you were, say, an American, I'd politely take you aside and say "by the way, that word is incredibly derogatory and racist!"


It's like when my Norwegian friends are talking English and suddenly swear like a trooper. Or when we're at the school gymnastics competition and the young 7-10 year old girls walk out to a rap song with the lyrics "I'm gonna f*** you in the *ss". (My wife and I laughed and laughed about that one.) If it had been in Norwegian people would have been up in arms, but in English not that many people understood it or could even hear the lyrics over the beat, and even if they did it didn't resonate with them the way the lyrics would in their mother tongue.

Basically what I'm saying is: if the person's talking to you is from a different culture from you, don't get offended, don't react quickly, take some time and gently correct them or inform them of what you hear them saying.
Patience, communication, and bearing with one another, in other words.

This also goes for when someone from another culture says "this word means this in my culture and is extremely offensive" lets be quick to find other ways to say what we want to say. After all communication isn't saying stuff, communication is saying stuff in a way that people understand what you say! :)
 

TV's Frink

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We generally take a dim view of people telling us how to moderate.

And for the record, this...

All the US moderators...claimed it was "inherently sexist".

is not true.
 

ThrowgnCpr

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There are a number of problems with your examples DM, but I'm not going to continue this. This thread is locked down before it's gets ugly. I strongly suggest that if you have a problem with the language or people's response to the language that you send them a PM instead of trying to explain their feelings to them.
 

DominicCobb

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The n-word is one thing. This is certainly a term with a very American-specific racist history to its usage.

Mary Sue is completely different. Unless you are arguing misogyny doesn't exist outside the US, your argument is simply ridiculous. I explained this in the last thread. The term is sexist because it's always used as a criticism for female characters and not (the much more numerous) male characters. It's not just Americans doing that, it's plenty of people on the Internet from a variety of different cultures. There is nothing specifically American about its usage and it's really just a coincidence that in this particular case it was all Americans on one side and nonAmericans on the other.
 
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