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Really enjoyed episodes 4 and 5!

The stupid BBC America App plays this one commercial specifically for (and spoiling) this season of Doctor Who, and that's really stupid. It played about ten times while I watched these two episodes. Dumb spoilery marketing aside, I still was really surprised and impressed with the end of episode 5. 

6 was ok. Not my favorite but not terrible. I was just glad to get through to an episode that came out after the dumb commercial was made.
(02-26-2020, 04:51 AM)Zarius Wrote: [ -> ] 
(02-25-2020, 07:13 PM)TomH1138 Wrote: [ -> ](Sorry, I can't get rid of this block for some reason.
The Beeb said similar things in 1989. We all know what happened then.

Well, sure. The show absolutely can get cancelled. And of course no one at the BBC will say that things are going poorly. I wouldn't expect that. Nonetheless, I've become numb to all the cancellation articles. Just like the regenerations, the actual cancellation will probably happen after all the news sites stop reporting about it.  Tongue

And social media doesn't represent everybody, but I didn't see any excitement or anything other than animosity during Season 11, so even a relatively small positive buzz suggested to me that things were at least going better for the BBC than last season. YMMV.

Also, ratings for broadcast are down overall everywhere, as people get their entertainment from streaming sites and online purchases of episodes, etc.

Mind you, I'm not super enthused about the show myself. I've only caught a small handful of episodes since the Season 11 premiere, and even when I do feel like watching it, it's hard to find others who will watch with me. So this isn't me saying, "I think the show is still amazing; therefore, it can't possibly be struggling in the ratings." Plenty of shows that I think are better than current DW were nonetheless ratings turkeys. It happens. 

I didn't make my earlier statement (or this one) to pick on people who don't like the show now (especially when I'm somewhat ambivalent about it myself). I'm just exhausted from all the dire news articles, and if the cancellation actually happens this time, it will have no more or less to do with this article than any article that came before it. 

I hope I was more clear this time.

Just my two...um...Republic credits? Um...Gallifreyan...space-bucks, or something?  Big Grin
(02-27-2020, 01:12 AM)keithbk Wrote: [ -> ]
(02-25-2020, 07:13 PM)TomH1138 Wrote: [ -> ]Honestly, all the interest I've seen has been up this season from last. "Spyfall" and "Fugitive of the Judoon" finally seemed to generate some much-needed positive buzz, at least on the social media pages I've been following.

It seems like every single year, a news site claims that the ratings have fallen catastrophically, and ask (either rhetorically or to the head of the BBC) if the show is going to get cancelled. I've seen these articles constantly since I started watching over a decade ago. I think the news sites just like the clicks they get. 

(But no harm in letting us know what's being said by Deadline. Thanks for sharing the link, Asterix!)

It is not translating to retail sales.

During the Eccleston-Matt Smith era, we did 1 million in business every 14 months.  

Now, we are struggling to do $20,000/month.

The merchandise license-holders have dropped to just a handful of remaining companies, and they rarely produce new product. 

There is no demand.

Really? That's fascinating. Again, that's the opposite of what I've heard. Even people who say that the show isn't doing well usually say that the show will stay on the air for all the great merchandise sales alone.

But it sounds like you're speaking from experience. What retailer do you work for?
(02-27-2020, 06:43 PM)TomH1138 Wrote: [ -> ]
(02-27-2020, 01:12 AM)keithbk Wrote: [ -> ]
(02-25-2020, 07:13 PM)TomH1138 Wrote: [ -> ]Honestly, all the interest I've seen has been up this season from last. "Spyfall" and "Fugitive of the Judoon" finally seemed to generate some much-needed positive buzz, at least on the social media pages I've been following.

It seems like every single year, a news site claims that the ratings have fallen catastrophically, and ask (either rhetorically or to the head of the BBC) if the show is going to get cancelled. I've seen these articles constantly since I started watching over a decade ago. I think the news sites just like the clicks they get. 

(But no harm in letting us know what's being said by Deadline. Thanks for sharing the link, Asterix!)

It is not translating to retail sales.

During the Eccleston-Matt Smith era, we did 1 million in business every 14 months.  

Now, we are struggling to do $20,000/month.

The merchandise license-holders have dropped to just a handful of remaining companies, and they rarely produce new product. 

There is no demand.

Really? That's fascinating. Again, that's the opposite of what I've heard. Even people who say that the show isn't doing well usually say that the show will stay on the air for all the great merchandise sales alone.

But it sounds like you're speaking from experience. What retailer do you work for?

I own Who North America, http://www.whona.com
(02-27-2020, 06:43 PM)TomH1138 Wrote: [ -> ]
(02-27-2020, 01:12 AM)keithbk Wrote: [ -> ]
(02-25-2020, 07:13 PM)TomH1138 Wrote: [ -> ]Honestly, all the interest I've seen has been up this season from last. "Spyfall" and "Fugitive of the Judoon" finally seemed to generate some much-needed positive buzz, at least on the social media pages I've been following.

It seems like every single year, a news site claims that the ratings have fallen catastrophically, and ask (either rhetorically or to the head of the BBC) if the show is going to get cancelled. I've seen these articles constantly since I started watching over a decade ago. I think the news sites just like the clicks they get. 

(But no harm in letting us know what's being said by Deadline. Thanks for sharing the link, Asterix!)

It is not translating to retail sales.

During the Eccleston-Matt Smith era, we did 1 million in business every 14 months.  

Now, we are struggling to do $20,000/month.

The merchandise license-holders have dropped to just a handful of remaining companies, and they rarely produce new product. 

There is no demand.

Really? That's fascinating. Again, that's the opposite of what I've heard. Even people who say that the show isn't doing well usually say that the show will stay on the air for all the great merchandise sales alone.

As been mentioned, merchandise from the show has all but disappeared for the most part, no where near the levels they were a decade ago. Where Who makes its money is selling the show worldwide to different broadcasters.  Getting BBC America involved with the show has lead it to expand its budget and now animate missing episodes which they can use to exploit the classic serials and make money on DVD and Blu-Ray releases.
My review (left this on a couple of forums)


Pretty simple story really. Cyber-Lords looked hilarious, the concept is interesting, but they're really just drones. Ashad boiled down to nothing (were they flogging merchandise with Ashad's compressed form or something? At one point I was expecting the Teleshopping information to come up on screen)

I liked how they really teased Jodie was going to leave with this one, only for an old-school trope to emerge in one of the disposable human cast making the grand sacrifice instead.

Boy were the Cybermen lousy shots.

Does Chibnall 'ship Graham and Yaz? Jail bait Bradley.

The new origin for The Doctor isn't too bad, the Brendan stuff, a captivating part of the first instalment, is dismissed pretty sharply here as meaning very little. Shame.

Ruth remains an enigma..as does most of The Doctor's past in 'The division'.

Dawhan steals the whole story, but too much continuity porn, exposition, and wasted potential. Probably not going to hold interest on repeated viewing unless you're watching a reaction channel
Well... that was awful.  In what has been a pretty terrible season, with the occasional glimpse of hope here and there, this finale was so badly written and constructed that I literally sat there numb to everything that happened. 

Not sure what they were thinking with The Master going for the best over-acting award of the last 50 years, but I think they won.  A dreadful performance which left me not knowing whether to laugh or cry. 

More than that however, a story such as this,  which has so many implications to the history of the programme,  should never have been attempted when the show is in such a sorry state.  

Thanks Chibnall... for producing the worst season of Doctor Who I have ever seen.   Time for this Doctor Who fan to leave perhaps. 

Btw... If you enjoyed the programme I'm happy for you... this is just my opinion Wink
(03-02-2020, 05:24 AM)LastSurvivor Wrote: [ -> ]Well... that was awful.  In what has been a pretty terrible season, with the occasional glimpse of hope here and there, this finale was so badly written and constructed that I literally sat there numb to everything that happened. 

Not sure what they were thinking with The Master going for the best over-acting award of the last 50 years, but I think they won.  A dreadful performance which left me not knowing whether to laugh or cry. 

More than that however, a story such as this,  which has so many implications to the history of the programme,  should never have been attempted when the show is in such a sorry state.  

Thanks Chibnall... for producing the worst season of Doctor Who I have ever seen.   Time for this Doctor Who fan to leave perhaps. 

Btw... If you enjoyed the programme I'm happy for you... this is just my opinion Wink

I enjoyed the episode despite the massive flaws, but I very much agree on the season as a whole. It hasn't been kind to rewatch value much at all. Only four episodes out of ten were crucial when you kind of want that to be the case all year 'round in the way the RTD years were, or series five, or series nine. Viewers have turned the show off in droves too, this week's episode scored a 3.71, dismally low, and lower than what the final series of classic who was getting at it's peak
(03-02-2020, 09:44 AM)Zarius Wrote: [ -> ]
(03-02-2020, 05:24 AM)LastSurvivor Wrote: [ -> ]Well... that was awful.  In what has been a pretty terrible season, with the occasional glimpse of hope here and there, this finale was so badly written and constructed that I literally sat there numb to everything that happened. 

Not sure what they were thinking with The Master going for the best over-acting award of the last 50 years, but I think they won.  A dreadful performance which left me not knowing whether to laugh or cry. 

More than that however, a story such as this,  which has so many implications to the history of the programme,  should never have been attempted when the show is in such a sorry state.  

Thanks Chibnall... for producing the worst season of Doctor Who I have ever seen.   Time for this Doctor Who fan to leave perhaps. 

Btw... If you enjoyed the programme I'm happy for you... this is just my opinion Wink

I enjoyed the episode despite the massive flaws, but I very much agree on the season as a whole. It hasn't been kind to rewatch value much at all. Only four episodes out of ten were crucial when you kind of want that to be the case all year 'round in the way the RTD years were, or series five, or series nine. Viewers have turned the show off in droves too, this week's episode scored a 3.71, dismally low, and lower than what the final series of classic who was getting at it's peak

I've come to understand that the ratings really can't be judged so quickly as most people will watch the program on a delay.  One must also take into account the massive amounts of alternative programming that is available now compared to when the show aired in 1989.  

I'm disappointed that so many seemingly did not like the finale (or the season in general) as I thought it was the best the show has been since Season 5.  To me, there were a few episodes that were the focus of the overall plot of the Timeless Child, which is more than RTD ever did for the season finales. Usually we'd just get a word (Torchwood, Saxon) thrown in an episode and that was it.  Moffat obviously went much more in on the season long arcs, but to me that became a detriment of his era.  Last season Chibnall seemingly didn't want to have any arching plotline, and I was fine with it in general though it made a very underwhelming finale.

With the 3 part finale this season, the buildup and anticipation was great and hooked me right back into the show in a way I hadn't been in a while.  I think the new Master is amazing and is already contending for my favorite iteration of the character (already the best NuWho has to offer as far as I'm concerned).  As for the overall implications, I think it can lead to some very interesting potential stories in the future, but does little to effect the show for me overall.  I can understand people being upset, but I just feel its being overblown especially considering the amount of times the show rewrote its history throughout the course of the classic era to many degrees.
Wow, I am really surprised to see so much dislike for this season here. I was really let down by the last Capaldi season and was only interested in watching Whitaker's first season to see what she could bring to the role. I was again really let down by the stories last season. With the exception of Orphan 55, I have liked every episode this season, and the three-part finale kept me on the edge of my seat the whole time. I watch each week with several other people who have been watching since 2005 but are pretty unfamiliar with the classic series, and we had to pause during

the memory montage as the Doctor escaped from the Matrix when the faces from The Brain of Morbius showed up on screen, confirming them as real past regenerations.
[Image: Morbius_Doctors.JPG]
We're planning on watching The Brain of Morbius and The Deadly Assassin over the next couple of weeks so they can find out some more about life on Gallifrey before the Time War.